What is it about McIntosh?

[Xulonn]

Urinating contest... right. I'll see myself out then, sorry you feel that way.

Actually, it wasn't you that prompted my comment. Plus, my ego also gets me in trouble over some things, but not in audio anymore. No one likes to be challenged on their stands that are not supported by reason, logic, and careful analysis - but almost all of us have such opinions.

 

[direstraitsfan98]

I was never trying to make a point or a 'stand', I was just a passionate audiophile sharing a new purchase I was excited about. I'm not trying to defend my purchase; I don't feel like there's anything to defend. I agree with all your points other then the vulgar thing you said that I don't really want to repeat. You say I didn't prompt you to make your comment, but you'll have to excuse me if I'm skeptical about that.

 

[Xulonn]

You say I didn't prompt you to make your comment, but you'll have to excuse me if I'm skeptical about that.

You are not the one who was going on about touting McIntosh superiority over Benchmark - you just want to enjoy your fancy new toy - been there, done that. And have fun.

 

[direstraitsfan98]

You are not the one who was going on about touting McIntosh superiority over Benchmark - you just want to enjoy your fancy new toy - been there, done that. And have fun.

I think by the time I get to your age (25% there....) I'll have the exact same sentiments about this hobby. Again, you'll have to excuse me... I'm young, impressionable, and still constantly enthralled by this hobby. Also, I appreciated that story you told about seeing mcintosh in the store with the bozaks 40 years ago. I believe you mentioned it before in another thread. You, along with Dunzl are treasures of this forum, I like reading your anecdotes you have to share. Please share more of them.

 

[Xulonn]

I think by the time I get to your age (25% there....) I'll have the exact same sentiments about this hobby. Again, you'll have to excuse me... I'm young, impressionable, and still constantly enthralled by this hobby. Also, I appreciated that story you told about seeing mcintosh in the store with the bozaks 40 years ago. I believe you mentioned it before in another thread. You, along with Dunzl are treasures of this forum, I like reading your anecdotes you have to share. Please share more of them.

I would have been overjoyed to get a C28 preamp and a MC2205 power amp with its two blue meters in 1976, but my budget was limited and I wanted a $3K pair of custom JBL S8 speakers - so I bought the MAC 1900 receiver instead. Had the MC452 existed then, I would have drooled over it, but not able to afford it. In today's world, if McIntosh made a superb mini DAC+Class-D amp I would still be tempted, but such a component would probably still be out of reach for me.

At age 78, I am truly blessed to be able to still hear up to 10kHz. 1960 was 60 years ago, not 40 - and I could hear up to 20kHz. That Mac/Bozak system was in a three chair barber shop, four feet in front of the barber-chair foot-rests, not a store. Stereo for home systems was only 2 years old at the time, and had gone commercial in 1958. My own system as a freshman in college was still monaural.

Your are the new wave.

 

[Siwel]

@amnpr: I can't answer you point by point as our discussion goes further off the rails and becomes increasingly irrelevant

There is no world's greatest amp, but there is the right product for the job. The Mc is the right product if long term satisfaction, retained value, high current, low distortion, full features (this is new to me that Mc amps aren't fully featured) broad bandwidth is desired. Benchmark makes nothing quite like it. Application matters. Now if we need to get into Bryston or Mark Levinson we need a different thread.

 

[direstraitsfan98]

Give it a break guys...

 

[Siwel]

Give it a break guys...

You're asking for a lot but I can comply! This is a discussion better suited to one line replies anyway. Like ner ner ner ner! Congrats on your new amp!

 

[Xulonn]

The Mc is the right product if long term satisfaction, retained value, high current, low distortion,

And that is why Benchmark amps are never seen in pro audio where 2Ω loads are common - only McIntosh amps are used in such applications with their stringent requirements for low distortion, tough loads and long-term reliability. /s

 

[mhardy6647]

Three Mac pieces here -- one in regular use.
They made some pretty nice tuners.

DSC_7288 (2) by Mark Hardy, on Flickr

 

[Digital Mastering System]

I mean wall or desk clocks.

This is the best clock I've ever seen:https://www.wv7u.com/cwc/hourglass.html

 

[maverickronin]

If you owned a Benchmark would you use the Speakons and with what hi fi speakers? I find them pointless for any domestic application and without value except for PA (at which the Benchmark would be woefully inadequate). Just like a McIntosh, not a good option there either actually, except the Mc has better binding posts

2) The beauty of the SpeakON is that the connection is secure. Always. Bare wire into a binding post is never the best connection. Unless you solder the terminals. Could just be marketing shtick but here's the copy:

I'm mostly a headphone guy, but I'm kind of amazed that bare wire, spades, bananas, etc are still in use. They're flat out dangerous. You never see even a dinky little phone charger with unshielded pins flapping around in the breeze waiting to short out but this is somehow considered acceptable for single devices that can output most of what an average house circuit can supply.

Speakons solve that problem nicely, even if you will need to mod your expensive new speakers.

 

[anmpr1]

I was never trying to make a point or a 'stand', I was just a passionate audiophile sharing a new purchase I was excited about. I'm not trying to defend my purchase; I don't feel like there's anything to defend. I agree with all your points other then the vulgar thing you said that I don't really want to repeat. You say I didn't prompt you to make your comment, but you'll have to excuse me if I'm skeptical about that.

I have no problems with anyone owning McIntosh. With these things, a person looks around at what is available and how many dollars are in his purse. If the two match up and the match is from Binghamton then they'll be happy. If they drive an hour north to Syracuse for their amp, that is a good match also. Farther north, to Ontario is good, but I understand you can't get through the border now because of the flu.

It just depends on what one is looking for.

When I bought my current set up I cross shopped Mac. I also looked at Lux. Because of possible need for support, between the two I would have gone with McIntosh. Easier to send a defective product to NY than Yokohama. Although the Luxman product had a nice look 'n feel to it, too. That I went with something else doesn't mean I don't understand why someone would choose a different brand.

 

[anmpr1]

Speakons solve that problem nicely, even if you will need to mod your expensive new speakers.

SpeakONs are by practical necessity a one end solution, unless one has pro loudspeakers. That is mostly true. Instead of bare ends at the speaker terminals, I've found that locking/expanding plugs make the best alternative connection. McIntosh terminals appear to be screw-on clamps you can torque down. I'm sure they hold the wire securely, but I've had issues with screw plugs coming loose. In any case, I think one ought to check connections routinely.

The worst connections are RCA plugs. Mark Levinson was right when he decided to get rid of those (although I think one of his reasons was to make his gear impossible to connect to other brands). SpeakON and Neutrik XLRs are miles ahead of the usual RCA, twist on, or (god forbid) spring loaded terminals.

 

[BeepPeep_61]

As the saying goes ....
listen to your McIntosh amplifier relaxing with great music and ..... don't care about them ....

 

[Siwel]

And that is why Benchmark amps are never seen in pro audio where 2Ω loads are common - only McIntosh amps are used in such applications with their stringent requirements for low distortion, tough loads and long-term reliability. /s

I'm back, I guess. Neither Benchmark nor McIntosh are sensible options within most pro application contexts. In studio work you can use just about anything since the application is little different than it is in hifi; a fixed location that doesn't change, weight being inconsequential, limited changes in configuration and amplifiers not stressed any more than they would be in any other 2 channel application. Here connections will be protected within racks and never get changed.

Few PA applications conform to such requirements. For example large segments of the pro world require 70 Volt lines for distributed audio (not a requirement in hifi) which radically alters the output connections and signal requirements. Others (PA hire companies are the best example) require light weight coupled to high power, rack mounted and stackable......usually meaning fan cooled. And so it goes. Neither Mc nor Benchmark serve these needs except on the fringes (studio monitoring). Either or both would make fine studio/recording amps bit that is the general limit of their utility in pro, not to mention that the broad acceptance of powered speakers makes this already specialized segment even less attractive to many manufacturers, notable exceptions over the years not withstanding.

These days Mc (which used to command more pro use) and Benchmark are effectively only used in consume applications with pro use confined to very specific and limited opportunities.

 

[Xulonn]

Neither Mc nor Benchmark serve these needs except on the fringes.

Speaking of fringes, I met Bob Weir of the Grateful Dead back in the 1980s when he was considering installing a solar domestic hot water system for his home. At the time, I had a couple of Grateful Dead albums, had seen them live a few times, and enjoyed their music, but I was not a part of the fanatical "Dead-head" crowd in the Bay Area. (Most of those die-hard fans would have swooned for an opportunity like mine to meet Bob in person at his home!) His house was very nice and upscale - but rustic - and was located in a grove of tall redwoods high above the town of Mill Valley - and there just was not enough hours of direct sunlight for a solar system.

I arrived on time for a morning appointment, and I was greeted at the door by his "butler" (??), who offered me a glass of juice while I waited for Bob to finish his shower. I remember the kitchen/great room opening to the garden and redwood grove via a wood and glass sliding door that was big as a barn door. Bob at the time looked like a 1980's typical straight, clean-cut guy with a pleasant smile, and a friendly and intelligent demeanor. I had already determined that solar would not work at his home, and we talked about that.

Like all good in-home salesmen, before "getting down to business", I had delivered some honest complements about things he obviously took pride in, which was very easy to do in that beautiful setting. So our "business" was quickly completed, and then he offered me a tour of his personal recording studio in a building next to the house. He noticed my white Mazda RX4 GTR, a modified rotary -engined coupe with its black rocker panel strip with the letters "GT-R" and a flat-black painted hood. He showed me his BMW 2002Tii as we talked about the joys of driving small, stick-shift sports cars around the hills of Marin County and the Bay Area. That meeting was a very pleasant and memorable experience with a celebrity who was really down-to-earth, and with whom I shared a few interests.

But I digress - here are some pics and a video about the Grateful Dead and McIntosh audio hardware...and a photo of some of the cabling used in pro applications.

 

[Siwel]

I'm mostly a headphone guy, but I'm kind of amazed that bare wire, spades, bananas, etc are still in use. They're flat out dangerous. You never see even a dinky little phone charger with unshielded pins flapping around in the breeze waiting to short out but this is somehow considered acceptable for single devices that can output most of what an average house circuit can supply.

Speakons solve that problem nicely, even if you will need to mod your expensive new speakers.

Nobody uses them in hifi. There are good reasons for that. When was the last time you were injured or placed in harm's way by banana plugs?

 

[Frank Dernie]

Nobody uses them in hifi.

Good engineering lead makes are beginning to, but since the fashion is for non-engineering bollox in high end hifi sensible engineering is less saleable than megabucks cables. Which is mind numbingly stupid but reality

 

[infinitesymphony]

Okay, we've talked on and on about the fonts, the colored lighting, the meters, the tubes, the extreme power handling, the ability to crush your enemies with them, but for me it's all about...

Knobs.

Seriously. I spent an afternoon at a dealer with a large amount of McIntosh equipment and while the equipment itself didn't necessarily speak to me, the feel of the knobs was spectacular. They were smooth, heavy, and had a sense of acceleration as you turned them. They were like the BMW steering wheel version of a knob. You've gotta take 'em for a spin.