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Revel F228Be, is it that far behind?

veeceem

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So my bro travelled to the other end of the country and auditioned Salon2 / Studio2 / F228Be. Driven by a pair of ML 536 mono blocks.
So far he gave them such score/scale from Salon2 as 10: 10/8/5
I wonder from what perspective F228Be that far behind? They measure well :/ I really like them but wonder if Studio2s are better pick because they are only $4000 more. (Salon2 too big for my room)
Place of audition:
IMG_20200109_162627.jpg
 

solderdude

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You would have to ask yo bro. he scored it that way depending on what his/her references are in that particular setup.
 
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veeceem

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You would have to ask yo bro. he scored it that way depending on what his/her references are.
True :) but I want to ask from a science/measurement standpoint :) thats why I started the thread in ASR :)
Thanks for replying
 

MarcT

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True :) but I want to ask from a science/measurement standpoint :) thats why I started the thread in ASR :)
Thanks for replying
Yes, I like your question because I also wondered about how to differentiate those options, from a scientific or measurement standpoint. I like the extra mid range driver on the Salon 2, but those things are really big. Also, I've heard the F228Be at audio shows and they sound great, but I don't know if it can achieve the dynamics of either of the Ultima 2 models, and you can now get the Studio 2 for some great used prices.
 

Kal Rubinson

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I wonder from what perspective F228Be that far behind? They measure well :/ I really like them but wonder if Studio2s are better pick because they are only $4000 more. (Salon2 too big for my room)
Yes, I like your question because I also wondered about how to differentiate those options, from a scientific or measurement standpoint. I like the extra mid range driver on the Salon 2, but those things are really big. Also, I've heard the F228Be at audio shows and they sound great, but I don't know if it can achieve the dynamics of either of the Ultima 2 models, and you can now get the Studio 2 for some great used prices.
1. The F228Be measures comparably well.
2. I did the blind mono test at Harman HQ and found that the F228Be was almost indistinguishable from the Salon2!
3. I did a non-blind test at the Harman Store in NYC and marginally preferred the Studio2 to the F228Be.
4. I bought the Studio2s partly for the sound, partly for the appearance. I do not care for the Performa3 visual design.
5. The Studio2s are discontinued but used/B-stock may suffice.
 

kaka89

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1. The F228Be measures comparably well.
2. I did the blind mono test at Harman HQ and found that the F228Be was almost indistinguishable from the Salon2!
3. I did a non-blind test at the Harman Store in NYC and marginally preferred the Studio2 to the F228Be.
4. I bought the Studio2s partly for the sound, partly for the appearance. I do not care for the Performa3 visual design.
5. The Studio2s are discontinued but used/B-stock may suffice.

Hi @Kal Rubinson, I have always love to read your subjective comments.

May I know what is your thought on 8C comparing with Revel F228Be?
Both speakers measured very well, I wonder how big of a difference does 8C's cardioid midrange, boundary-coupled bass design makes?

Thank you for your time.
 

blueone

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In that photo the Salon2s do not appear to be placed for best sound. In my experience they don't like being near side walls at all. They also look to be about six feet out from the back wall, which might make the bass octaves a little lightweight, at least without one or more subs. That's the problem with speaker comparisons; placement often goes unoptimized.
 

murraycamp

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VintageFlanker

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That's the problem with speaker comparisons; placement often goes unoptimized.
Sure. Even without being placed close to the wall: Perceived soundstage and imaging will differ due the space between speakers being larger for one pair over the other.

This kind of positioning seems fair to me:

Screenshot_20200109-172119_YouTube.jpg
 

solderdude

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Ahh that's what these are for ! :facepalm:
 

Kal Rubinson

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Hi @Kal Rubinson, I have always love to read your subjective comments.
Thanks.
May I know what is your thought on 8C comparing with Revel F228Be?
Both speakers measured very well, I wonder how big of a difference does 8C's cardioid midrange, boundary-coupled bass design makes?
I preferred the 8C in my room and would have bought them except:
1. I am a very conservative investor and am concerned about the long term success of the company and long term support of the product, As an all-in-one, the failure of one component or a change in standards requiring software updates might be critical.
2. I was unsure of the effective use of the 8C in multichannel setup.
3. As a reviewer, it would not be as convenient for reviewing other audio components as more conventional speakers.
4. My wife hates floor-stander speakers.
Other than that.......................................

P.S.: FWIW, I am looking forward to a visit from Martijn Mensink this afternoon and expect to become a lot better informed about these things.
 
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daftcombo

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Sure. Even without being placed close to the wall: Perceived soundstage and imaging will differ due the space between speakers being larger for one pair over the other.

This kind of positioning seems fair to me:

View attachment 45148
I like the stands he uses for the Aria. Do you know the reference?
 

777

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Salon 2, Studio 2 and F228Be
 

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MarcT

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Salon 2, Studio 2 and F228Be
So, for us newbies who are still learning how to understand these graphs, is there a takeaway from these, in terms of which might work best in certain room types and speaker placements?
 

Kal Rubinson

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These graphs show the FR change across the horizontal axis (0deg). Note that this means the on-axis FR is represented as perfectly flat which, although it is pretty good in all cases, it is not. What I see in this is that the change is smoother with the F228Be although the change is minimized up to a higher frequency in the Salon2 and the Studio2. That said, you cannot judge these without reference to the actual on-axis FR and/or viewing them all in a Spinorama.
 

CDMC

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Not to mention the effect on that turntable...

Funny, I saw an advertisements for the Klipsch Sixes and it make that turntable setup look optimal. It is clear the Sixes are not intended for sound quality, just appearance and selfies based on Klipsch's own photos. I am guessing Paul Klipsch is rolling in his grave.

The-Sixes-Hero-3.jpg
The-Sixes-Hero-5.jpg
The-Sixes-Hero-1.jpg
 
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