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Why do people associate High End audio with snake-oil?

svart-hvitt

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REAL HIGH END

524943634457168733530922.jpg
 

Xulonn

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I do not mind the search for visual aesthetics when it come to High End Audio. I find it actually appealing. What bothers is the pretense of elevated/superior performance.
Indeed - I agree completely. But a search for images of esoteric and/or exotic audio hardware yields many visually interesting components that are the playthings of hardcore subjectivist audiophiles, with little information available that is related to verifiable measurements.
 

cjfrbw

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Talking to the pilgrims who have visited some of the ultra expensive edifice systems of sometimes highly vocal blingsters, it is surprising how often they report sound that disappoints them. They will never be rude enough to tell their hosts or say much in public, but in private, they shake their heads.

Some of the high end guys can be gossipy about each others' systems, too, not always in flattering ways.
 

RayDunzl

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Xulonn

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A lot of the bling and wealth display for it's own sake is actually distracting.
one of the best systems I ever owned was anchored by a Bryston B60R integrated amplifier and a pair of Apogee Centaurus ribbon monitors.

Zero bling, only the most essential controls, and excellent sound.

Bryston B60R.jpg


Apogee Centaurus Ribbon Monitors.jpg
 

cjfrbw

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Heh, Heh, Amir's train wreck was as much about opposing commercial motives as about delivering perspective on expensive systems. If you go up against somebody's artificially generated, but profitable, mythology, you're in the hornet's nest by definition because you're tampering with THEIR MONEY.

Clearly, in the last 20 years, untold reams of loose capital have been unleashed into the pockets of well heeled audiophiles all over the world to generate these incredible furnitures. So catering, misleading, fantasizing etc. all tend to go with the territory to loosen up those bursting audiophile wallets.

I enjoy the art and extremism, too, to a certain extent, but as Frantz said, associating it with actual performance merely on the cost and flash metric is obnoxious.

I remember a guy from a show display that I commented on getting mad at me for calling him a 'vendor'. He got his panties in a twist over a term that did not elevate the pretense to his desired level.
 
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cjfrbw

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one of the best systems I ever owned was anchored by a Bryston B60R integrated amplifier and a pair of Apogee Centaurus ribbon monitors.

Zero bling, only the most essential controls, and excellent sound.

View attachment 14581

View attachment 14582
I actually have a pair of these speakers, and also the slanted ones that look like mini-Apogee shapes, and a pair of larger Centaurus Minors, that I use for a total of six surround speakers. Once in a while, I listen to these smaller box Apogees with a stereo signal, and, yes, they sound great, even into my 19' x 13' room.
 

svart-hvitt

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Rather this is the perfect illustration of an elevated Bottom End. Some veil (not all) have been lifted in this picture

Some boys are more creative than others when trying to lift that high end veil.

9782800151595_cg.jpg
 

cjfrbw

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Here's one of Nelson Pass' listening laboratories. Do you really think the sound in this room sucks? Even my clutter mess of a system looks better and more affluent.
Nelson_Pass_listening_room_02-22-2018.jpg
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If he doesn't like the phase relationship of a speaker, he can just walk over and move it with his hand.

He probably has an industrial listening room at the factory that looks more hi tech, but who knows.
 
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restorer-john

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here's one of Nelson Pass' listening laboratories.

Want to stir up the hornet's nest? There's a Technics SL1200 turntable in Nelson's system! That alone would get the collective high end's entire panty collection in a twist!
 

SIY

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Heh, Heh, here's one of Nelson Pass' listening laboratories. Do you really think the sound in this room sucks?

Nelson has a separate building next to his house that's a large and acoustically excellent listening room. After spending a day in there, I was quite envious.
 

cjfrbw

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Nelson has a separate building next to his house that's a large and acoustically excellent listening room. After spending a day in there, I was quite envious.
I would imagine such, with all of the money, tech and testing facilities from Pass Labs at his disposal, but he is not above listening in convenience spaces that aren't many audiophiles' idea of dream spaces with various permutations of ad hoc and vintage speaker types.
 
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SIY

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Nor should anyone be, if they like music. I even listen in my car, heaven forbid.:cool:
 

Grave

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Hi-Fi is dirt cheap. :D

I have spent much more money on my PC because more money actually translates into better performance.
 

Sal1950

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Nelson has a separate building next to his house that's a large and acoustically excellent listening room. After spending a day in there, I was quite envious.
Here's one of Nelson Pass' listening laboratories. Do you really think the sound in this room sucks? Even my clutter mess of a system looks better and more affluent.
If he doesn't like the phase relationship of a speaker, he can just walk over and move it with his hand.

He probably has an industrial listening room at the factory that looks more hi tech, but who knows.
I've always found Nelson one of t the most interesting characters in HiFi, right up there with Bob Carver and Gordon Holt LOL. Besides designing components at the forfront of the SOTA, he loves to play with all sort of toys and variations just to hear the results. Being a fan of large horn speakers, I would love to hear the KleinHorn project that he and others put so much time into designing.
Now if only I had the room ----------------------
kleinhorn2_2.png
 

SIY

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That's the room and setup next to his house.

And yes, Nelson is a terrifically interesting person. I've enjoyed my time and interactions with him over the years.
 

cjfrbw

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Looks like the El Pipe-o's right in the center in the back. Can't imagine a system more of a positive 10 on the nerd scale and a negative 10 on the WAF scale.

"Get that flippin' thing OUTA HERE NOW!"
 
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restorer-john

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It looks like upturned extraction hoods from a commercial kitchen along with the oven flues at the back in black. :)

Can either of you comment on what it sounded like?
 
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