Denon AVR-X4800H AVR Review

[rvsixer]

I'm surprised there's no further comments on the ground issue? Amir knows what he is doing, and with his test rig/methodology I don't recall this happening before. So I am worried this is something induced by the Denon?

 

[ArturoKiwi]

In the States, the 3800 is $1,700 (now on sale for $1,500), the Cinema 50 $2,500, the 4800 $2,500 and the C40 $3,500.

They are much more expensive than the previous models but if you have 4 subswoofers, you get independent sub control. So for 1% of folks who have 4 subs, these AVRs are a dream come true. For the other 99%, we're wondering what happened.

Definitely different price!
For me it's more difficult the choice between Denon and Marantz, because they have about 200€ difference

 

[peng]

The X4700, 3700 can not do this selectively it is either all power amps on or pre amp only mode, with SINAD considerably better in pre amp only.

Minor correction, those AVRs can disconnect the front left and front right power amps using the amp assign feature, that's what Amir used when measuring the X3600H and got over 100 dB SINAD.

 

[antcollinet]

In the States, the 3800 is $1,700 (now on sale for $1,500), the Cinema 50 $2,500, the 4800 $2,500 and the C40 $3,500.

They are much more expensive than the previous models but if you have 4 subswoofers, you get independent sub control. So for 1% of folks who have 4 subs, these AVRs are a dream come true. For the other 99%, we're wondering what happened.

Same question here. I'm wondering what the extra £770 (over here) for the 4800, compared with the 4700 brings.

 

[peng]

Definitely different price!
For me it's more difficult the choice between Denon and Marantz, because they have about 200€ difference

Yes, it is a tough one for you, but an easy one in the US and Canada. Here, I think they can get away with charging a much higher premium for Marantz's probably because Marantz was originated in New York so people here are more willing to be a sucker for the Marantz brand, all else being equal..

 

[peng]

amirm said:
I did but using the new scheme where I change the volume control rather than digital level

Don't you think this method of measurement improves the results? thin bLue also measured Cinema 50 this way (SINAD at 5W) and achieved better results than 3800 measured in the old way.

Also keep in mind thin blue use lower input vs the 0 dBFS Amir always used. thin blue acknowledged that later, when Amir questioned:

Showed little clippings for 0. So, I gave some advantages for them.
Set 0dBFS will show little worse numbers, I forgot to mention!!! Thanks!

Marantz Cinema 50 AVR Review

And if you don't want to spend so much money, maybe a RZ50 with Dirac included could be your choice

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[techsamurai]

Same question here. I'm wondering what the extra £770 (over here) for the 4800, compared with the 4700 brings.

Well, it finally brings HDMI 2.1 since the previous units only had 1 HDMI 2.1 port. But I don't think a company can charge for basic HDMI connectivity when that's all the video connectivity they offer nowadays.

 

[ivo.f.doma]

Also keep in mind thin blue use lower input vs the 0 dBFS Amir always used. thin blue acknowledged that later, when Amir questioned:

Marantz Cinema 50 AVR Review

And if you don't want to spend so much money, maybe a RZ50 with Dirac included could be your choice

www.audiosciencereview.com

Even so, with these measurement changes, I can't get rid of the feeling that the 4800 "had to" measure better than the 3800 with the same DAC, because it is €900 more expensive...

 

[peng]

Even so, with these measurement changes, I can't get rid of the feeling that the 4800 "had to" measure better than the 3800 with the same DAC, because it is €900 more expensive...

Sure, but you will find too many examples that show it does not always "had to", just look at the SINAD (pre out) ranking chart and you have got to laugh right? I know you are just kidding though..

See how the $999 AVR-X3600H and the $1199 AVR-X3700H, AKM IC version, priced at launch, beat the >>€900 AVRs and AV Processors, including the €4,500 AV8805A!!

 

[ArturoKiwi]

Yes, it is a tough one for you, but an easy one in the US and Canada. Here, I think they can get away with charging a much higher premium for Marantz's probably because Marantz was originated in New York so people here are more really to be a sucker for the Marantz brand, all else being equal..

If I would like to maintain my external amps, it seems to me the C50 the best choice

 

[Ajax]

Thanks for the review Amir.

Reinforces my view that if you are particular about sound quality then you need two systems - one for music and one for movies.

 

[Fidji]

Is there any other product that scores in the middle of orange range that is on the recommended list?

 

[sask15]

Is there a sample like this of the 3700 SINAD that could be made for the 4800?

 

[CyrusTheGreat_600BC]

Is there any other product that scores in the middle of orange range that is on the recommended list?

SINAD number is not the only factor in Amir’s recommendations. Price, amplifier quality to drive harder speakers, clipping, to name a few also has impact.

 

[Carycinema]

Just to clarify, in 11.1 mode the above two models also support only front/right channel preamp outs disconnected from amps, while all remaining preouts remain connected to amps (the amps are not turned off). I just reread the reviews to make sure, as its been a while.

You can select which ones you want to disconnect. I have the Front, rear and center disconnected due to using external amps. I use the internal amp to power the Dolby Atmos speakers.

 

[Carycinema]

Definitely different price!
For me it's more difficult the choice between Denon and Marantz, because they have about 200€ difference

Personally after having the Cinema 50, don't bother. The Denon 4800H Marantz equivalent is the Cinema 40 which is $1k more, for what?
To me the Denon 4800H sounds better, especially in the bass region.

 

[RandomEar]

@amirm Maybe the volume sweep could be presented in another form, which is easier to read / more intuitive. I took the liberty of extracting the data from your time-based sweep and plotted it differently:

To make it a bit prettier, one can apply some smoothing:

This is a quick MATLAB / Octave script. If you are interested in plotting the data like that for future reviews, please let me know. Depending on how your analyzer logs the raw data, it could be possible to script a one click solution.

 

[Fidji]

SINAD number is not the only factor in Amir’s recommendations. Price, amplifier quality to drive harder speakers, clipping, to name a few also has impact.

If you look at the measurements there are issues everywhere. Regression from past generation in objective performance with increase in price.

There was a strong benefit of the doubt applied here,

 

[peng]

@amirm Maybe the volume sweep could be presented in another form, which is easier to read / more intuitive. I took the liberty of extracting the data from your time-based sweep and plotted it differently:
View attachment 270929

To make it a bit prettier, one can apply some smoothing:
View attachment 270930

This is a quick MATLAB / Octave script. If you are interested in plotting the data like that for future reviews, please let me know. Depending on how your analyzer logs the raw data, it could be possible to script a one click solution.

Thank you.

 

[peng]

If I would like to maintain my external amps, it seems to me the C50 the best choice

If you like it's look/style, for 200 Euro $, it is a good choice where you are, but may be not here in NA.