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AXPONA: Mark Seaton, Seaton Sound
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NorthSky
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NorthSky
Major Contributor
- Joined
- Feb 28, 2016
- Messages
- 4,998
- Likes
- 946
NorthSky
Major Contributor
- Joined
- Feb 28, 2016
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My Mom was in that last one, pro acoustically treated...in Montreal...with a big organ too. ...Last month, for some recital classical music...with 94 musicians.
In its day, the humble pipe organ was at the pinnacle of technology.
Wiki:
"The origins of the pipe organ can be traced back to the water organ in Ancient Greece, in the 3rd century BC, in which the wind supply was created with water pressure. By the 6th or 7th century AD,bellows were used to supply organs with wind. Beginning in the 12th century, the organ began to evolve into a complex instrument capable of producing different timbres. A pipe organ with "great leaden pipes" was sent to the West by the Byzantine emperor Constantine V as a gift to Pepin the Short, King of the Franks, in 757. Pepin's son Charlemagne requested a similar organ for his chapel in Aachen in 812, beginning the pipe organ's establishment in Western church music. By the 17th century, most of the sounds available on the modern classical organ had been developed. From that time, the pipe organ was the most complex man-made device - a distinction it retained until it was displaced by the telephone exchange in the late 19th century."
Wiki:
"The origins of the pipe organ can be traced back to the water organ in Ancient Greece, in the 3rd century BC, in which the wind supply was created with water pressure. By the 6th or 7th century AD,bellows were used to supply organs with wind. Beginning in the 12th century, the organ began to evolve into a complex instrument capable of producing different timbres. A pipe organ with "great leaden pipes" was sent to the West by the Byzantine emperor Constantine V as a gift to Pepin the Short, King of the Franks, in 757. Pepin's son Charlemagne requested a similar organ for his chapel in Aachen in 812, beginning the pipe organ's establishment in Western church music. By the 17th century, most of the sounds available on the modern classical organ had been developed. From that time, the pipe organ was the most complex man-made device - a distinction it retained until it was displaced by the telephone exchange in the late 19th century."
D
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Orgel Acusticum in Piteå Sweden.
9000 pipes, playable over the internet. Benny Andersson (from ABBA) played on it during its inauguration 2012.
- - > http://www.dlaplay.se/#/video/christoph-bossert
Sorry, not Benny in video above.
But here he is ...
9000 pipes, playable over the internet. Benny Andersson (from ABBA) played on it during its inauguration 2012.
- - > http://www.dlaplay.se/#/video/christoph-bossert
Sorry, not Benny in video above.
But here he is ...
Last edited by a moderator:
OP
- Thread Starter
- #27
Amazing instruments! How did they used to power these in the olden days?
"The old-fashioned way is to have an enormous set of "bellows" which are pumped up and down by a person using a large handle. This sucks in air and fills the wind chest. Pumping the bellows of a large pipe organ is heavy work."
OP
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Thanks. Somehow I thought they were steam powered or something!
NorthSky
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Yesterday I watched some videos, and among them those two:
______
We all know that bass, some of the lowest and most imposing are from the largest pipes of an organ (8Hz).
I have some music recordings of that magnificent musical instrument, but my sound system cannot resolve the low notes of an organ, and with full power @ that.
It would take tremendous power (amplifiers) and several huge quality subwoofers that can play clean down to 8Hz and with high volume levels (130dB or so).
Unfortunately I cannot affor to replicate this instrument @ home with full veracity and verve. Best would be to play one, or listen to one live.
Most movies are made of special sound effects, except for some real orchestral works in the soundtrack, ...organ/synthesizer from the film Interstellar.
I went to see Interstellar @ one of my local theaters when it was released; the bass took the entire theater's space by storm, and didn't let go for an extended period of time, it was truly powerful. And that theater is just a normal theater with probably blown up speakers, because I also heard gross distortion @ times.
I have that film on Blu-ray; it's a good one. But my room is small and 120dB is about my max. It does shake my couch, but the walls are still standing @ the end.
I would love to be able to crash my walls by falling down on my head and the roof with it, but I simply cannot.
Can Mark Seaton help with that?
Yes, It would be real swell to reproduce the world largest organs in our home; that would be a true feat/accomplishment.
Another film I like sound wise is The Fifth Element with lots of variations and activity from the audio soundtrack.
Subwoofers, we love them and can't live without them. Those large organs are truly amazing; eight rooms filled with pipes, and from many many years ago, hundred(s),...way before surround sound was invented, and subwoofers too! Those guys, from Ray's super interesting link which tells the history of the organ, were way ahead of anything else. Just look @ the sheer size, the complexity, the number of pipes, the wind needed to blow those pipes, all the rooms and space to put those pipes in, the construction, the main grid, the playing board, the pedals, all the tickets (colors from the various family voices), the cockpit!
Yes, this is Axpona and Mark Seaton's demo room with Dolby Atmos surround sound and his subwoofers; movies.
And this is also audiosciencereview with just over hundred members; and there wouldn't be a single post if it wasn't for the organ.
Again, check Interstellar on Blu-ray, because there is some powerful organ music in it, and subwoofers are a must...not any Charlie Brown (Peanuts) or Mickey Mouse subs, but Godzilla or King Kong subs.
This thread I like, because not only for the bass, but also for where she is from...the magnificent organ; the meanest of them all analog sound reproduction.
It gave me the opportunity to learn more about it, and with you too who participate in this passionate music reproduction of the lowest musical notes from this planet. And again, Ray's link is awesome; I did not know that the organ was that old. It is simply and absolutely fascinating.
"The origins of the pipe organ can be traced back to the water organ in Ancient Greece, in the 3rd century BC, in which the wind supply was created with water pressure. By the 6th or 7th century AD,bellows were used to supply organs with wind. Beginning in the 12th century, the organ began to evolve into a complex instrument capable of producing different timbres. A pipe organ with "great leaden pipes" was sent to the West by the Byzantine emperor Constantine V as a gift toPepin the Short, King of the Franks, in 757. Pepin's son Charlemagne requested a similar organ for his chapel in Aachen in 812, beginning the pipe organ's establishment in Western church music. By the 17th century, most of the sounds available on the modern classical organ had been developed. From that time, the pipe organ was the most complex man-made device - a distinction it retained until it was displaced by the telephone exchange in the late 19th century."
Kids today they like 170 decibels in their cars from RAP music. Me, I'm a kid too but with different musical taste, I love organ and Opera music, among others.
We all have something in common; subwoofers to reproduce the lows we love, the lows that can break the bones in our bodies, and our heart too.
It's a beautiful day today on our beautiful blue planet.
______
We all know that bass, some of the lowest and most imposing are from the largest pipes of an organ (8Hz).
I have some music recordings of that magnificent musical instrument, but my sound system cannot resolve the low notes of an organ, and with full power @ that.
It would take tremendous power (amplifiers) and several huge quality subwoofers that can play clean down to 8Hz and with high volume levels (130dB or so).
Unfortunately I cannot affor to replicate this instrument @ home with full veracity and verve. Best would be to play one, or listen to one live.
Most movies are made of special sound effects, except for some real orchestral works in the soundtrack, ...organ/synthesizer from the film Interstellar.
I went to see Interstellar @ one of my local theaters when it was released; the bass took the entire theater's space by storm, and didn't let go for an extended period of time, it was truly powerful. And that theater is just a normal theater with probably blown up speakers, because I also heard gross distortion @ times.
I have that film on Blu-ray; it's a good one. But my room is small and 120dB is about my max. It does shake my couch, but the walls are still standing @ the end.
I would love to be able to crash my walls by falling down on my head and the roof with it, but I simply cannot.
Can Mark Seaton help with that?
Yes, It would be real swell to reproduce the world largest organs in our home; that would be a true feat/accomplishment.
Another film I like sound wise is The Fifth Element with lots of variations and activity from the audio soundtrack.
Subwoofers, we love them and can't live without them. Those large organs are truly amazing; eight rooms filled with pipes, and from many many years ago, hundred(s),...way before surround sound was invented, and subwoofers too! Those guys, from Ray's super interesting link which tells the history of the organ, were way ahead of anything else. Just look @ the sheer size, the complexity, the number of pipes, the wind needed to blow those pipes, all the rooms and space to put those pipes in, the construction, the main grid, the playing board, the pedals, all the tickets (colors from the various family voices), the cockpit!
Yes, this is Axpona and Mark Seaton's demo room with Dolby Atmos surround sound and his subwoofers; movies.
And this is also audiosciencereview with just over hundred members; and there wouldn't be a single post if it wasn't for the organ.
Again, check Interstellar on Blu-ray, because there is some powerful organ music in it, and subwoofers are a must...not any Charlie Brown (Peanuts) or Mickey Mouse subs, but Godzilla or King Kong subs.
This thread I like, because not only for the bass, but also for where she is from...the magnificent organ; the meanest of them all analog sound reproduction.
It gave me the opportunity to learn more about it, and with you too who participate in this passionate music reproduction of the lowest musical notes from this planet. And again, Ray's link is awesome; I did not know that the organ was that old. It is simply and absolutely fascinating.
"The origins of the pipe organ can be traced back to the water organ in Ancient Greece, in the 3rd century BC, in which the wind supply was created with water pressure. By the 6th or 7th century AD,bellows were used to supply organs with wind. Beginning in the 12th century, the organ began to evolve into a complex instrument capable of producing different timbres. A pipe organ with "great leaden pipes" was sent to the West by the Byzantine emperor Constantine V as a gift toPepin the Short, King of the Franks, in 757. Pepin's son Charlemagne requested a similar organ for his chapel in Aachen in 812, beginning the pipe organ's establishment in Western church music. By the 17th century, most of the sounds available on the modern classical organ had been developed. From that time, the pipe organ was the most complex man-made device - a distinction it retained until it was displaced by the telephone exchange in the late 19th century."
Kids today they like 170 decibels in their cars from RAP music. Me, I'm a kid too but with different musical taste, I love organ and Opera music, among others.
We all have something in common; subwoofers to reproduce the lows we love, the lows that can break the bones in our bodies, and our heart too.
It's a beautiful day today on our beautiful blue planet.
NorthSky
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Holy grail of mother organ! ...Right @ home!
* The mother of a girlfriend from 45 years ago played the organ, but she didn't have those other rooms full of pipes; it was all integrated in the organ unit itself. She was driving her husband and children nuts! ...Oh man, those were the golden years of my musical journey.
Michele was her name (girlfriend), and she was awesome in sewing my clothes, language translation, and fun playing snooker in the basement. Yup, they had a snooker table and we played with her two brothers. And from the basement we could hear her Mom playing the organ from upstairs in the living room, and her husband yelling @ her to turn it down, while trying to read his books. Her Mom was recording herself too, from one of those small portable cassette recorder/players that come with a small mic...remember those...from the late 60's early 70's era.
And her Mom she was very jovial and kept playing louder just to enrage her husband, with a big smile and that mischievous tone to it.
It's funny the families we grew up with when we were teenagers. They came in all flavors and colors.
Low frequencies can drive some people mad, and can create euphoria with others. ...It depends on where you come from.
So many people so little time to know them all...7.35 billion people. ...That's s lot of space to cover with low frequencies; you would need another planet to generate the energy power required for filling it entirely. ...The sun rays would probably do. ...A giant laser gun directly connected to it, as the main grid.
Another flick that I really like is Tron: Legacy with Daft Punk music. ...On Blu-ray and in 3D. Turn that one up to eleven, and feel the elevation, be transported to the next dimension, visit the grid on your futuristic motorcycle, race the corridors of virtual reality, and don't forget to bring your frisbee with you, on your back...in case.
* The mother of a girlfriend from 45 years ago played the organ, but she didn't have those other rooms full of pipes; it was all integrated in the organ unit itself. She was driving her husband and children nuts!
...Oh man, those were the golden years of my musical journey.Michele was her name (girlfriend), and she was awesome in sewing my clothes, language translation, and fun playing snooker in the basement. Yup, they had a snooker table and we played with her two brothers. And from the basement we could hear her Mom playing the organ from upstairs in the living room, and her husband yelling @ her to turn it down, while trying to read his books.
Her Mom was recording herself too, from one of those small portable cassette recorder/players that come with a small mic...remember those...from the late 60's early 70's era.And her Mom she was very jovial and kept playing louder just to enrage her husband, with a big smile and that mischievous tone to it.
It's funny the families we grew up with when we were teenagers. They came in all flavors and colors.
Low frequencies can drive some people mad, and can create euphoria with others. ...It depends on where you come from.
So many people so little time to know them all...7.35 billion people. ...That's s lot of space to cover with low frequencies; you would need another planet to generate the energy power required for filling it entirely. ...The sun rays would probably do. ...A giant laser gun directly connected to it, as the main grid.
Another flick that I really like is Tron: Legacy with Daft Punk music. ...On Blu-ray and in 3D. Turn that one up to eleven, and feel the elevation, be transported to the next dimension, visit the grid on your futuristic motorcycle, race the corridors of virtual reality, and don't forget to bring your frisbee with you, on your back...in case.
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Bob, the grandeur, sense of huge size and space of a pipe organ doesn't require impressive bass, just a competent system,
. The real qualities of that instrument come from the midrange action, and I've made the pipe organ take over the house many, many times with small, extremely basic speakers - the richness of the harmonics is the deal, and I haven't heard any other systems as yet do justice to this sort of music - they're always come over thin and small, they haven't the capacity to project the sheer intensity of the organ sound ...
NorthSky
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Absolutely Frank.
I'd like to be in that room with you in Sidney where they have that big and beautiful organ,
then go to your place and listen to a recording of it. ...Just for the fun of it...for comparison.
To hear the differences, check if all the cards are in place in the two different spaces.
Who knows what we might discover ....
I'd like to be in that room with you in Sidney where they have that big and beautiful organ,
then go to your place and listen to a recording of it. ...Just for the fun of it...for comparison.
To hear the differences, check if all the cards are in place in the two different spaces.
Who knows what we might discover ....
Last edited:
Chuck Gerlach
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I was not in that room but I have measured 4 different rooms with Mark's subs in them, the most recent being this week with 4 of the 18's that he had at Axpona. In EVERY case, the output was flat to 10HZ and MAYBE down 5 to 7 db at 5 HZ. If the material had low bass in it, it was placed into the room. I have yet to hear a better sub than Mark's. A year or so ago, I needed some money to pay for some other gear and sold my 4 SubMersives and went DIY - the biggest mess up I have made in audio in over 40 years. I have remedied it some by buying 2 SubMersives (sold 2 of the DIY subs) and hopefully by years end will have 3 to 4 of his 18's in addition to the 2 SubMersives.
Hi Amir,
Thank you very much for taking the time to come back once the HDMI gods were fed and happy again to pass modern audio formats.
Thank you for the compliments on the system. Do note that what you heard was without the intended final polish of a detailed calibration and running Dirac. Ken Whitcomb of Calibrations Inc is responsible for getting the great picture on the screen with the Lumagen and Sony 5000ES projector. We were in fact expecting to only use a 665ES, but the originally intended space for the 97 lb behemoth didn't pan out, and we benefited with Ken measuring almost 32 ft-lamberts on the 115" wide, 16:9, Enlightor 4k screen from Screen Excellence.
It was quite the adventure in our first effort to set up an Atmos system at a 3 day show, and we learned a lot in the process while giving those who came back Saturday and especially Sunday an experience most didn't think was achievable in the home, and I know few realized that sort of bass could be had in such a large room (the shell was 60' x 32' x 13').
While the Sony projector and video system did push us to a nearly $100,000 setup, the audio portion was less than $35,000 of that.
Even with the amusing derailment into the depths of organ history, it appears you are creating a unique space with these forums, and I look forward to participating more in the future if there is interest and are relevant topics.
Many thanks again for the reporting!
Hi Marty,
Thank you for the compliments. The desire to sit and enjoy the system for that length of time in spite of so many other options affirms it was worth the effort to me. It always amazes me how surprised the un-initiated are that an experience like we demonstrated is easily scaled to their home.
NorthSky
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Hi Mark,
The organ derailment wasn't a derailment. There is no train but there is entertainment.
That was a distraction, an attraction, a coup to get your foot inside the room.
Thx
The organ derailment wasn't a derailment. There is no train but there is entertainment.
That was a distraction, an attraction, a coup to get your foot inside the room.
Thx
Hi Mark,
The organ derailment wasn't a derailment. There is no train but there is entertainment.
That was a distraction, an attraction, a coup to get your foot inside the room.
Thx
I understand the context and certainly appreciate a powerful organ performance. I was more amused that there was any questioning about VLF content in modern movies or music. It seemed like a flashback to discussions from 10-15 years ago. Great bass extension punctuates the experience and makes everything subjectively larger and more real... when done properly. Of course I've become rather jaded in my expectations as 16Hz in-room extension is what I consider limited VLF extension.
