Really glad this is being explored. Although, it has to be said, In vids of the amp driving speakers - mostly Borensen - it does sound very clear/transparent and powerful, meaning, to these ears it sounds good. Although, 100watts into 8ohms is not particularly powerful for a ClassD amp?
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Axxcess Forte 1 with 'Tesla Coils' - legit or snakeoil?
- Thread starter alpha_logic
- Start date
Any old amp will sound clean, powerful and transparent… And if you’re lucky, even though YouTube 
They didn’t even bother to develop their own Class D technology, borrowed Pascal modules. Clearly they are way to preoccupied twisting wires into coils..
They didn’t even bother to develop their own Class D technology, borrowed Pascal modules. Clearly they are way to preoccupied twisting wires into coils..Class D != digital
Lol right. On the Tesla tech, I cannot comment as i've not heard results in person. I do own a good number of amps incl: solid state transistor, Class D, Class D/ Class A hybrid, Tube (valves), and Triode Tube/ Solid State hybrid monos. They all 'sound' different to me and my lady. Some excel in the PRaT department - as boogie machines, while others are more detailed. Some are exceptional at creating a huge wide soundstage. The best has most all and sacrifices little.Any old amp will sound clean, powerful and transparent… And if you’re lucky, even though YouTube
Class D != digital
The Axxess Forte 1 being discussed here is an integrated amp with DAC and streamer. I own several DACs; ladder resister, and Delta Sigma. Most recently I purchased the EverSolo DMP-A6 Signature streamer with inbuilt DAC. That's a great product which I feel is goid value, but its internal DAC is still outclassed by other standalone DACs I have. I have an Oppo 205 also, which garnered an excellent result on Amir's test bench.
Understanding the limitations of YouTube, and in consideration that some videos use very good mics while others just dobthe iPhone recording, I can definitely hear what I would consider a very good presentation from the Axxess Forte 1, despite listening through airpods on my iPad or alternatively, my Sennheiser HD650 or HD750, or Oppo 'phones through my Oppo portable headphone amp HPA2.
I know that the circle of 'reviewers' on YouTube have essentially become shills that coordinate together sometimes, which creates suspicion as to whether the results are as good as they profess.
It would be cool if Amir put this integrated amp through its paces to see if there is any truth to some reports of the Axxess Forte's excellent performance for the money. On that point, I think some of these reviewers are completely divorced from reality. $5,500 for example, for most folks is a LOT of money when one has bills to pays and a family to support. Not saying its not worth it, just that it shouldn't be positioned as this fabulously cheap bargain. Its not cheap. Today I ran into and watched an Absolute Sound video on Michael Fremer's crazy expensive system. That guy is off his trolley in a sense. The esoterica he reviews is only available to a very small, very wealthy segment of the population. Therefore completely irrelevant to almost everyone on earth.
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Hi
Not too sure about what to make of your post. It could be an attempt at humor but the lack of smilies makes it difficult to taking it humorously... Especially when you invoke the notion of "PRaT" one of the most noxiously horse manure notion in Audio. You also involved your lady... I suppose she could hear the "vast" differences (my terms) ... from the kitchen ...
??? And the better DACs that create a "wide" soundstage??thus, my question...if this is not an attempt at humor...Do you seriously believe in what you wrote and believe they would fly, unchallenged, here?
Peace.
D
Deleted member 21219
Guest
You must have some amps with really poor performance - high distortion and poor stability - for their "sound" to be that obvious. Competently designed amps have no "sound" ... they simply pass an electronic signal with no modification except gain.
When anyone posts such assertions here, they are asked to do the one things that tethers them to reality; perform a blind test on their equipment to verify their claims. This test is not for our edification ... it is for YOUR edification.
The protocols are here:
The reason that such discipline and rigor are necessary is that the mind plays tricks on us; there is a whole set of biases that enable the brain to improve effectiveness for survival, but which render it worthless for accurate data retrieval.
A list of those biases can be seen here:
List of cognitive biases - Wikipedia
Jim
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Or you can get a nice poster (for off-line use) here
: https://thethinkingshop.org/collections/products/products/cognitive-biases-wall-postersIf those coils are supposed to be antennae doesn't one coil cancel the effect of the opposite one, re-radiating the energy? Anyone ever see a real antennae designed like this? And if connected at both ends the inductance is zero and there's no high freq. impedance.
One more thing. Amir invites people to participate happily and with grace. He does not do so to alliw morons like you to destroy people's day with harsh and utterly disrespectful rudeness. You cannot SHAME me into believing what you do. I've listened to systems for 50 years and love to listen to and play music. You are very bad for this site, and for thosecwho love and want to explore this hobby in general. I hope you get pulled up for your disrespectful and hateful post.
MAB
Major Contributor
Perhaps you haven't read some of Amir's responses when people manifest pseudo-science as you did.
You got a good response for your post. It was hard to follow, and we wonder if you are having a joke. Same as if you posted a "square wheels run smooth" post in a automobile forum. Sorry that you are the joke here.
Calling people childish names while saying they are making hateful and disrespectful posts is absurd.
Also, while you are name-calling, perhaps you can learn to spell Børresen.
D
Deleted member 21219
Guest
It would be a good idea for you to dial it back. If someone posts something you don't like, contact the mods. That's much better than attacking them in the forum. Besides ... you might not get the response that you think you'll get.
I think you may have taken much of this in a spirit far from what was intended, and when your responses devolve to name calling, it makes me think a little break is in order.
He is far from a moron, and is a valued and respected member. A little teasing is not attacking, belittling or shaming you.
This site isn't like most others, so I hope you'll take advantage of your time off to get to know the place a little better, and can interact in good faith going forward.
I can think of one legitimate use for a bifilar "Tesla" coil. It can form a self resonant RF filter if wired inductively. From the Wikipedia article:
This could be used instead of a conventional LC filter on power supplies, inputs, or outputs to suppress power supply noise and electromagnetic interference (EMI). Whether these coils are configured and used in such a manner in this product, I don't know. But if you have use for EMI suppression, it's cool if you can call it a "Tesla coil".
MAB
Major Contributor
Yes, they are very useful in such an arrangement.
However, only one end is connected in this gear, which renders the inductor as useless antennae with no effect even if there was a noise problem to solve. It is a bogus circuit.
It looks, walks and quacks like snake oil - it is probably quite oily.I've never seen an amp with what they call 'Tesla Coils' which apparently serve the purpose of dealing with voltage spikes. Would love to hear what the community has to say about this topic : )
Axxess Forté 1 - All-in-One Player
Axxess Forté is a high performance all-in-one player featuring Streamer, DAC, Integrated Amplifier & Headphone Amplifier and is available in three levels - Forté 1, 2 and 3. All three models contain identical primary components and boast the same broad specifications. The only difference between...online.nextlevelhifi.com
View attachment 348078
MAB
Major Contributor
I think you are looking at the wrong picture.
Axxcess Forte 1 with 'Tesla Coils' - legit or snakeoil?
I've never seen an amp with what they call 'Tesla Coils' which apparently serve the purpose of dealing with voltage spikes. Would love to hear what the community has to say about this topic : ) https://online.nextlevelhifi.com/products/axxess-forte-1-streaming-amplifier
www.audiosciencereview.com
The traces are so poorly rendered, with so few turns and such poor line spacing this that any inductive effect is negligible. Plus, this is not a useful circuit instance even if these were interesting coils.
This is from OP's original link, and represented in the company's marketing materials all over.
It's really hard to make this up, but they did.
Just for starters, how would you even know what you're hearing is because of the amp and not because of the reviewer's mic, mic position, speakers, where they're standing in the room, and then finally youtube compression?
Also... WHY USE A MIC AT ALL?
If people were seriously interested in hearing differences in amps... like seriously, actually, not just talking about hearing them... they'd use an attenuator and record directly from the speaker terminals. Because putting speakers between you and the signal is adding ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE more distortion than any decent amp designed this century produces.
It's like... hey, let's taste this whiskey... but first let's put 0.5oz of whiskey into a gallon of cola. Or, no, how about just taste the effing whiskey?
Anyone who is actually serious about amps, not just serious about posting online content about amps for clicks, would 1000% know this and not bother recording speaker output in the first place. It's a terrible approach to the problem if you think about it for 5 seconds.
I urge you to reconsider whether you are hearing what these youtubers (any youtuber) encourages you to think you're hearing.
mhardy6647
Grand Contributor
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umm... walks?
I believe they probably do have quacking snakes in Australia. If so, I am sure they are lethally poisonous.
Well since we are not talking about snakes, but about oil from same, then I'm gonna suggest none of look/walk/quack should be taken totally literally.umm... walks?
I believe they probably do have quacking snakes in Australia. If so, I am sure they are lethally poisonous.
Oh and I miswrote - it should have been waddle, not walk. Cos we all know how good oil is at waddling
Plus - if you look at the top view of the rectangular PCB containing coils - not 100% clear, but it very much looks like only soldered at one end.I think you are looking at the wrong picture.
If you look at their boards, including the so-called 'active square Tesla coils', one end only of each inductor is connected to active. The bifilar coils only have one lead soldered. The PC board traces are hilarious:Axxcess Forte 1 with 'Tesla Coils' - legit or snakeoil?
I've never seen an amp with what they call 'Tesla Coils' which apparently serve the purpose of dealing with voltage spikes. Would love to hear what the community has to say about this topic : ) https://online.nextlevelhifi.com/products/axxess-forte-1-streaming-amplifier
View attachment 351346
The traces are so poorly rendered, with so few turns and such poor line spacing this that any inductive effect is negligible. Plus, this is not a useful circuit instance even if these were interesting coils.
This is from OP's original link, and represented in the company's marketing materials all over.
It's really hard to make this up, but they did.
The closeup of the one on it's own also suggests the coil just doubles back on itself for the second part of the winding - no terminal to be soldered at that end.
It is really really REALLY REALLY difficult for a coil/inductor to do anything at all without current flowing through it.
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