Has anybody heard the new KEF KF92 sub? What are your opinions?

[radio3]

This is not video abut audio but more on acoustics and this guy knows his stuff. Anyway, since you already have KEF LS50 and you want good looking gear, I don't think you can go wrong with the


Hi Radio3,
I did some crude measurements using the RealTraps Test Tone CD and radio shack SPL meter. I tried the subwoofer crawl but realized how rediculous this method is (for me anyway). Bass response was down approximately 10db at 20Hz (My Radio Shack meter is probably very inaccurate in this range). Also when driven hard with a 20hz signal, it made some mechanical noises (sub was new and maybe not properly broken in). There was an article from some Australian reviewer with measurements on the web but I can't find it any longer. It measured very well but not much energy below 25Hz. I think the output of this sub is probably equal or slightly less to JL Audio E-Sub e110. I went with KEF due to visual matching and cone material that matches my R500. I hope this answers your question.

Thanks, yes that helps. I've been kicking myself for the last year for not buying one when they were so cheap everywhere. I think it's about like an SVS SB2000, though maybe with slightly less extension. I read that article too, and I thought it looked like it rolled off pretty slowly, so that if you have a couple subs you could EQ that bottom octave up a little and be fine. But no way to really know without actually trying, I suppose. I love that it is a dual opposing design. I'd love to have one up on a bookshelf to even out sound between seated and standing positions. The sub appear to almost be exactly the same as this KF 92, just with slightly different drivers (same size) and smaller amp. Was an incredible steal when on sale.

 

[Killingbeans]

Is size your main concern? If so I would look at JL E110 and E112.

Nice! I'm foolin' around with the idea of getting a Genelec setup for nearfield listening/gaming and I realise that I'd might have to supplement it with a sub at some point down the road. I don't like the aesthetics of the Genelec subs, but I'd like something compact without compromising too much on performance. That's why the KEF KF92 caught my attention. JL E110 seems to be more up my alley though

 

[radio3]

I wonder how the Elac dual opposing sub designs that are similar perform (2070 and 2090).

 

[bo_knows]

Thanks, yes that helps. I've been kicking myself for the last year for not buying one when they were so cheap everywhere. I think it's about like an SVS SB2000, though maybe with slightly less extension. I read that article too, and I thought it looked like it rolled off pretty slowly, so that if you have a couple subs you could EQ that bottom octave up a little and be fine. But no way to really know without actually trying, I suppose. I love that it is a dual opposing design. I'd love to have one up on a bookshelf to even out sound between seated and standing positions. The sub appear to almost be exactly the same as this KF 92, just with slightly different drivers (same size) and smaller amp. Was an incredible steal when on sale.

Hi Radio3, it is and it was. When compared to similar subs from SVS, B&W and REL, I found KEF to have a better construction (as it should for the price). The only regret I have is that I didn't wait long enough for a new model to be available but then it wouldn't match my older R series speakers. It would match perfectly my black and blue LS50W in my living room (hehe).

https://imgur.com/a/2tMkJnb

 

[killdozzer]

Where are you? In the US market, KEF subwoofers have always had a reputation for underperforming, thanks to alternatives like Rythmik and HSU (and to some extent SVS) which are much better price performance values.

Edit: I see reading further you're in the EU.

Yes. Some of the solutions you have at hand, I don't. There are some ID good performers, but as I said, I'm first trying to find a sub that has some of the features I'm looking for. BK is a performer, it is cheap, well built, ugly and has no DSP.

I've been digging through what's on offer for some time now and believe me, when you want to tick a few boxes, the number of the models on offer rapidly dropps. For example; give me a recommendation of a sub from any of the three brands you named that is no bigger than the KF92, has DSP and highpass on the returning signal... See? There really aren't that many. I read specs for years now. q3cpma found one from Dynaudio, but it's bigger and ugly, that's why I'm not jumping on it. Also, bear in mind that SVS is not such a good value for money in EU as they come significantly more expensive. I've seen a SVS SB3000 black ash at Crutchfield at 1k, the best I could find after sweeping the online web shops for months is 1.5k for the same model in a shop in Germany (at least the shipping is included).

Same goes for Rythmic ID. By the time I'd get it here, it would be the worst deal of the month.

I'm not all that stuck on KF92, but don't want to write it off before I see some reliable measurements as I'm not in a hurry.

 

[killdozzer]

I wonder how the Elac dual opposing sub designs that are similar perform (2070 and 2090).

Now, there's an idea!!! I'll check them. It's just that I remember that the one with DSP was for some reason not on offer in EU. At least when I last checked.

Thanks for reminding me. ELAC has a good reputation, worth checking.

 

[stevenswall]

JL Audio is king of high output in small enclosure

This makes me respect SVS more looking at the price of the PB12-NSD. Curious where a Devialet Phantom would lie on this graph, and why they haven't made a dedicated subwoofer.

 

[Tokyo_John]

I'll be in the market for a sub fairly soon, about to close on a house and will need it in the new listening space.

So I'm curious if the OP or others have more opinions on the KC92 since this thread went quiet. KEF has also released the cheaper KC62, and that seems to have gathered far more attention and press than the KC92. I still have no idea how the KC62 and KC92 compare. And I haven't seen any solid measurements (including compression) for either one.

It is impossible to get SVS, Rhythmik, or similar high value/cost subs here in Japan, so I'm stuck with pricier options. KEF subs are priced similarly to other places. We can also get Monitor Audio and (of course) Yamaha, Dali, Genelec, and if we have deeper pockets there is Eclipse.

 

[bo_knows]

I'll be in the market for a sub fairly soon, about to close on a house and will need it in the new listening space.

So I'm curious if the OP or others have more opinions on the KC92 since this thread went quiet. KEF has also released the cheaper KC62, and that seems to have gathered far more attention and press than the KC92. I still have no idea how the KC62 and KC92 compare. And I haven't seen any solid measurements (including compression) for either one.

It is impossible to get SVS, Rhythmik, or similar high value/cost subs here in Japan, so I'm stuck with pricier options. KEF subs are priced similarly to other places. We can also get Monitor Audio and (of course) Yamaha, Dali, Genelec, and if we have deeper pockets there is Eclipse.

I just got KC92 from KEF. It's a better sub than my older R400B. It goes deeper and you can feel and hear (to some extend) the difference.
I don't have any experience with the other brands. Call me brand (KEF) loyal. This upcoming week (when time permits) will be tunning the sub and the rest of my R series speakers via Audyssey. Results will be double-checked via REW. If anyone is interested, I can post REW diagrams, room dimensions, and equipment here. No subwoofer crawling for me.

 

[bo_knows]

I surely hope the KEF is more capable than what those What Hi-Fi graphs showed. Nowhere is any of their curves goes above 100 dB SPL. This USD $2k sub got to do better than that!

I just got this sub. Like other KEF stuff, it's quality over quantity.
I use it for music and home theater in small/medium size room with listening SPL that never exceed100 dB C weight. If a potential customer has a larger dedicated home theater room, enjoys loud explosions in the moves, and needs to rattle house foundation or walls, I could see better value options there.

 

[Tokyo_John]

...Like other KEF stuff, it's quality over quantity...listening SPL that never exceed100 dB C weight...

Sounds a lot like what I need for my setup, I don't really need more and I probably don't want much less. KEF says the KC62 loses about 5 dB relative to the KC92, and I'm hearing from some that the KC62 begins to struggle above 90 dB SPL. Even if it is just a 5 dB difference, at these low frequencies this can be significant. The KC62 anyways has to work harder to play at the same levels as the KC92.

 

[dasdoing]

I just got this sub. Like other KEF stuff, it's quality over quantity.
I use it for music and home theater in small/medium size room with listening SPL that never exceed100 dB C weight. If a potential customer has a larger dedicated home theater room, enjoys loud explosions in the moves, and needs to rattle house foundation or walls, I could see better value options there.

I doubt more then 100dB is necessary even for the heaviest movie explosion at cinema volume level cause
a) the graphs show the SPL for single frequencies. no single frequency will ever reach 0dBFS. I am not a movie guy, so I have not enough motivation to investigate this, but I doubt a single frequencie in an explosion will exceed -10dBFS. at 85dB/-20dB pink noise volume this means a max of 95dB
b) and does anybody realy watch movies at cinema level? it's stupidly loud. I go 6dB under when watching alone, and 9dB under when watching with my girlfriend (else she complaints)

 

[dasdoing]

I doubt more then 100dB is necessary even for the heaviest movie explosion at cinema volume level cause
a) the graphs show the SPL for single frequencies. no single frequency will ever reach 0dBFS. I am not a movie guy, so I have not enough motivation to investigate this, but I doubt a single frequencie in an explosion will exceed -10dBFS. at 85dB/-20dB pink noise volume this means a max of 95dB
b) and does anybody realy watch movies at cinema level? it's stupidly loud. I go 6dB under when watching alone, and 9dB under when watching with my girlfriend (else she complaints)

ok, a) is not actualy the correct calculation. one should meassure a single frequencie at 0dBFS in a system calibrated to movie level. and there is the problem that the c-weightig rolls off below 100Hz. It is very strange that the movie guys have never actualy established the real SPL curve necessary, cause the 85+20 standard doesn't make any sense

 

[Katji]

It is impossible to get SVS, Rhythmik, or similar high value/cost subs here in Japan, so I'm stuck with pricier options.

Really no SVS distributor in Japan? Or referring to import tax + VAT [+shipping cost/s.]?
SVS is a major name brand, no problem to get in Kenya and Nigeria as well as S. Africa.

 

[Katji]

@killdozzer , It's 8 months later now, so what happened? Did you get a subwoofer?

 

[bo_knows]

Sounds a lot like what I need for my setup, I don't really need more and I probably don't want much less. KEF says the KC62 loses about 5 dB relative to the KC92, and I'm hearing from some that the KC62 begins to struggle above 90 dB SPL. Even if it is just a 5 dB difference, at these low frequencies this can be significant. The KC62 anyways has to work harder to play at the same levels as the KC92.

Some measurements and corrections I did today.

I took measurements with a straight mic and 90 deg position with their calibration files.

The green line is sub and purple sub plus mains (KEF R500) after Audyssey.

Room dimensions are 13.3feet wide, 14.9 deep, and 10 feet ceiling height.

The listening distance is 8.1 feet from the loudspeakers.

80Hz is the crossover frequency and the MultiEQ Filter frequency range is set to 400Hz for all speakers.

The picture of my room is listed in the previous post (#84).

The subwoofer is located next to the inner side of my right speaker and slightly behind.

I made some slight tweaks via the Audyssey app (-2 or so at 40Hz and + 2 at 60 Hz or so).
Since I'm using the iPhone, using the curve editor is very challenging.

The psychoacoustics filter was used in the files where FR is from 10Hz-20KHz.

All and all I'm very pleased with the results and subwoofer performance.

 

[Tokyo_John]

Really no SVS distributor in Japan?

None. Zero. Zilch. Nada.

Or referring to import tax + VAT [+shipping cost/s.]?

I haven't found any sellers in countries that have decent treaties with Japan who are willing to ship.

SVS is a major name brand, no problem to get in Kenya and Nigeria as well as S. Africa.

Nobody in Japan has ever heard of SVS. It is a major brand only in the countries where it is available.

Same is true of Rhythmik. Actually Rhythmik offers to ship kits from the US to overseas, but they insist on using USPS which charges an outrageous amount for international shipping (DHL is the only way to go, that is how I moved house to Japan some years ago).

 

[Tokyo_John]

Some measurements and corrections I did today...

What speakers (mains) are you using?

 

[bo_knows]

What speakers (mains) are you using?

Front Left and Right are KEF R500 and the center is R200C.

Measurements were done with KF92 and R500 only.
The receiver is Denon avr-x8500h.

According to REW measurements, the system now goes from 15Hz to 20Khz. Wow!

 

[Tokyo_John]

Front Left and Right are KEF R500 and the center is R200C...According to REW measurements, the system now goes from 15Hz to 20Khz. Wow!

View attachment 133149

Looks great! Love the bass traps and all, you have quite a setup there...the KF92 is quite a bit more beefy than the KC62, but looks like you can still squeeze it out of the way...

...recently I had a shot at buying a SVS SB-3000 from ebay, with hefty int'l shipping costs, would have been close to the cost of a new KC62 here in Japan. But I decided against it. Now I think I'll wait and get the KF92, it looks like a super solid sub and should last for a very long time.