Kef Blade Meta and Genelec discussion

[hvbias]

I haven't logged into ASR in a while and as such am late to the Kef Blade review thread that got locked so I can't add to it. I wanted to discuss these two speakers/companies as I saw several people saying to buy the cheaper Genelec The Ones plus sub(s). I don't think I post here enough for people to know what I was looking for- I am looking for some speakers for shared listening spaces and all the usual suspects were at the top of my list including larger Genelec The Ones and Kii 3 BXT. Kef Blade were never on my radar until very recently as my experience with the first generation LS50 was just average.

Now I would strongly disagree with the Genelec The Ones/subs competing with the Kef Blade Meta. I heard them on two different occasions and if you're not listening in the nearfield they simply sound like monitors just listened to at the further away distance even with the W371a, they pale in comparison at normal listening distances, they just sound small. I have never got this impression with the Blade Meta 2 I heard at a dealer. I wrote this about the Blade Meta 2 before the review in question came out (link to classical message board, posted on February 2, 2024) and full quote below:

I was able to hear KEF Blade Meta 2, I was blown away by what I heard. Among the best speakers I've heard at reproducing symphony music. Not surprisingly being pretty much the best measuring speakers directivity FR wise they sounded dead even throughout their entire bandwidth. Putting in Etymotic earplugs and playing way louder than I would ever listen I could not detect any compression.

Recreating a spiritual double header I came into a few weeks ago- Celibidache's live Munchner Bruckner Symphony 8 and Franck's Prelude, Chorale, and Fugue played by Michel Block. Sadly I could not listen to both pieces in full but it confirmed what I'd known; an incredible stereo elevates the emotional response of already great music/performances.

Now on my short list for shared space speakers.

Next will be the NYC dealer for MBL 101e for speakers I want to upgrade in the dedicated listening room.

Having said that I will be buying the 8341a to use at my practice's computer setup. I was sticking to the considerably cheaper 306 MK2 because we contract a cleaning company and theft worried me. But the Genelecs are so much better/more natural sounding than the JBLs that the risk is well worth it.

 

[Vacceo]

When you reach a certain point of technical excellence, what remains is personal preference.

 

[hvbias]

When you reach a certain point of technical excellence, what remains is personal preference.

Granted classical music is 80-90% of what I listen to and when I did the Blade 2 Meta demo I only used classical (in hindsight a bit foolish) but I would imagine most people would be able to hear the rather big difference in presentation with this genre. Even solo piano music which I strongly prefer to listen to within the first 10 rows of a concert sounded so much more "big"/real on the KEF in terms of that scale that fools the mind. My expectation was Genelec's subs would make them sound like full range tower speakers, which maybe on me!

 

[BlackTalon]

You heard both sets of speakers in the same listening space?

 

[Moonbase]

If you are using the first gen LS50's as a reference then you may well not be overly impressed and reviews on here reflect this view. Having said this subjectively many reviewers have been praising the LS50s for many years, to me this has been praise for half a speaker (sub required). Further the LS50 is a near field monitor. KEF has been listening and the Meta's speakers performance now reflects the many improvements KEF has delivered.

Listening to many KEF speaker over the years the Blade 2 Meta sound grand in medium to small rooms, thats not to say that in a large room they don't, it's simply I don't know.
Compared to the other option say the Kii 3 BXT, which may sound great, but a such ugly beasts or The D&D 8c which would be great option IMHO. Having said that the room match is everything.

 

[hvbias]

You heard both sets of speakers in the same listening space?

No but at identical distances. The room sizes were medium for all auditions.

If you are using the first gen LS50's as a reference then you may well not be overly impressed and reviews on here reflect this view. Having said this subjectively many reviewers have been praising the LS50s for many years, to me this has been praise for half a speaker (sub required). Further the LS50 is a near field monitor. KEF has been listening and the Meta's speakers performance now reflects the many improvements KEF has delivered.

Listening to many KEF speaker over the years the Blade 2 Meta sound grand in medium to small rooms, thats not to say that in a large room they don't, it's simply I don't know.
Compared to the other option say the Kii 3 BXT, which may sound great, but a such ugly beasts or The D&D 8c which would be great option IMHO. Having said that the room match is everything.

I had the LS50 years ago, bought them within a year of their release. Blade 2 were not using subs and they would play louder than I would ever listen, for my dedicated listening room I am looking at different speakers. I need to give Kii 3 BXT a chance, Kii 3 on their own sounded a bit bright to me but they were in mastering/mixing mode.

 

[Vacceo]

Granted classical music is 80-90% of what I listen to and when I did the Blade 2 Meta demo I only used classical (in hindsight a bit foolish) but I would imagine most people would be able to hear the rather big difference in presentation with this genre. Even solo piano music which I strongly prefer to listen to within the first 10 rows of a concert sounded so much more "big"/real on the KEF in terms of that scale that fools the mind. My expectation was Genelec's subs would make them sound like full range tower speakers, which maybe on me!

If you wanted to push to the limit, you could have tried organ music. That is, out of techno, how you test very low bass, infrasonics included.

 

[Ciobi69]

If you wanted to push to the limit, you could have tried organ music. That is, out of techno, how you test very low bass, infrasonics included.

A little bit too much for the blade 2 i think, the one could be ok with 4 9 inch

 

[Vacceo]

Subwoofers are meant for that, yet it's always fun to test floorstanders.

 

[amirm]

I need to give Kii 3 BXT a chance, Kii 3 on their own sounded a bit bright to me but they were in mastering/mixing mode.

Do you not have some kind of EQ? That is a must no matter which speaker you have to deal with room modes. Then while there, you can tailor the overall tonality to slope down.

On your question as long as you are ready to spend a lot of money, I would start with Genelec 8361A. This speaker will rival Blade 2 in bass response and overall dynamics. I tested it in far field so no issue with that. I don't think it needs a sub. Just a bit of boost in low frequencies as I applied in my review.

 

[Ciobi69]

Got blade myself only for a good price used the new meta otherwise my previous plam was the 8361 they are a work of arf

 

[Kal Rubinson]

A little bit too much for the blade 2 i think, the one could be ok with 4 9 inch

It depends on your needs and your levels. They don't complain but can do only so much.

 

[dfuller]

I need to give Kii 3 BXT a chance, Kii 3 on their own sounded a bit bright to me but they were in mastering/mixing mode.

The Kiis have slightly elevated top end by default - worth shelving down.

FWIW, I think the KH420s are bananas good. IMO much better than the 8361s.

 

[Vacceo]

Do you not have some kind of EQ? That is a must no matter which speaker you have to deal with room modes. Then while there, you can tailor the overall tonality to slope down.

On your question as long as you are ready to spend a lot of money, I would start with Genelec 8361A. This speaker will rival Blade 2 in bass response and overall dynamics. I tested it in far field so no issue with that. I don't think it needs a sub. Just a bit of boost in low frequencies as I applied in my review.

Hi Amir! I just checked out the prices around my close environment (Europe) and buck-performance ratio falls clearly on the Genelec side. For the price of two Blades, you'd get six 8361a.

In the price of the Genelecs you get amplification and EQ software, which is not the case of the Blades.

However, if the reason is aesthetics, wanting to keep using an amp you have or any other case, that is another matter that may or may not be relevant for the final user.

Personally, I'd not call snake oil buyer to a Blade user: they are expensive, but they are also very competent speakers.

 

[EdW]

Hi Amir! I just checked out the prices around my close environment (Europe) and buck-performance ratio falls clearly on the Genelec side. For the price of two Blades, you'd get six 8361a.

In the price of the Genelecs you get amplification and EQ software, which is not the case of the Blades.

However, if the reason is aesthetics, wanting to keep using an amp you have or any other case, that is another matter that may or may not be relevant for the final user.

Personally, I'd not call snake oil buyer to a Blade user: they are expensive, but they are also very competent speakers.

Well not quite 6 8361 in the UK to 2 blade 2 metas! The lowest price for 8361a (pair) in the UK is approx. £8400 about half what I paid for the KEF Blade 2 meta pair, Admittedly ex demo but flawless with full KEF warranty and not much haggling on my part, A factory order set would have raised the price by nearly £2000 and a delay. Even once you’ve bought your Genelecs you need robust stands and the resultant image is not pretty in a domestic setting. . .
As regards sound quality the 8361a is very unforgiving of bad recording. I only managed one rather unconvincing demo - more like take it or leave it - not great. Mind you the KEF is only slightly better with poor recordings in this regard. as I suspect Revel 2 salon would be equally revealing of poor recording but from the one demo I heard here the 2 speakers are pretty comparable. Bad recordings are just that!
The Revel 2 salon is not competitively priced in the UK and the significantly improved mid range in KEF Blade 2 meta over the Blade 2 non meta made it for me a better buy for me for the domestic enjoyment of music, Mind you if I were a studio engineer wanting to make very demanding recordings (they always should be of course!) then the 8361a might be a very suitable monitor set.

 

[Vacceo]

Well not quite 6 8361 in the UK to 2 blade 2 metas! The lowest price for 8361a (pair) in the UK is approx. £8400 about half what I paid for the KEF Blade 2 meta pair, Admittedly ex demo but flawless with full KEF warranty and not much haggling on my part, A factory order set would have raised the price by nearly £2000 and a delay. Even once you’ve bought your Genelecs you need robust stands and the resultant image is not pretty in a domestic setting. . .
As regards sound quality the 8361a is very unforgiving of bad recording. I only managed one rather unconvincing demo - more like take it or leave it - not great. Mind you the KEF is only slightly better with poor recordings in this regard. as I suspect Revel 2 salon would be equally revealing of poor recording but from the one demo I heard here the 2 speakers are pretty comparable. Bad recordings are just that!
The Revel 2 salon is not competitively priced in the UK and the significantly improved mid range in KEF Blade 2 meta over the Blade 2 non meta made it for me a better buy for me for the domestic enjoyment of music, Mind you if I were a studio engineer wanting to make very demanding recordings (they always should be of course!) then the 8361a might be a very suitable monitor set.

I have found less than 5000 euro/unit vendors for the Genelecs. Considering the 30.000 price of the Blades in th same vendors, that is 6 genelecs for 3 Blades.

Revel does not have distributors here at all.

 

[Arnas]

Well not quite 6 8361 in the UK to 2 blade 2 metas! The lowest price for 8361a (pair) in the UK is approx. £8400 about half what I paid for the KEF Blade 2 meta pair, Admittedly ex demo but flawless with full KEF warranty and not much haggling on my part, A factory order set would have raised the price by nearly £2000 and a delay. Even once you’ve bought your Genelecs you need robust stands and the resultant image is not pretty in a domestic setting. . .
As regards sound quality the 8361a is very unforgiving of bad recording. I only managed one rather unconvincing demo - more like take it or leave it - not great. Mind you the KEF is only slightly better with poor recordings in this regard. as I suspect Revel 2 salon would be equally revealing of poor recording but from the one demo I heard here the 2 speakers are pretty comparable. Bad recordings are just that!
The Revel 2 salon is not competitively priced in the UK and the significantly improved mid range in KEF Blade 2 meta over the Blade 2 non meta made it for me a better buy for me for the domestic enjoyment of music, Mind you if I were a studio engineer wanting to make very demanding recordings (they always should be of course!) then the 8361a might be a very suitable monitor set.

You dont need robust stand for Genelec speakers since isopods are included.
Then you save a ton of money on Amplication and dsp and cabling.
You can also eq them very easily for more forgiving response.

If i have unlimited funds i still would get Genelecs cause their room correction is very good and + sub integration is just perfect.
Would love to hear Blades to see if they are better, but on paper they dont offer anything more.

Kef did fantastic job with design, i imagine design also boost sales quite a lot.

 

[MTZ]

I recently purchased a pair of Genelec 8361's and their stands, the smaller 7360a subwoofer (i have a small room) and the 9320a reference monitor controller. This is now a full digital system with amplification,dsp and interface. With the GLM software it is also possible to get GRADE reports from Genelec with all the measurement information and suggestions for improvements.

I made this choice because i wanted to keep things as simple as possible, so no extra dac, preamp, amplifiers and separate dsp system.

The Kef Blades must sound great. Maybe even better? I saved myself the search for a dac, preamp, amplifiers and room correction. However this can be a lot fun to.
I'm very happy with my choice. And in comparison with my previous setup this is a huge step up.

 

[EdW]

I recently purchased a pair of Genelec 8361's and their stands, the smaller 7360a subwoofer (i have a small room) and the 9320a reference monitor controller. This is now a full digital system with amplification,dsp and interface. With the GLM software it is also possible to get GRADE reports from Genelec with all the measurement information and suggestions for improvements.

I made this choice because i wanted to keep things as simple as possible, so no extra dac, preamp, amplifiers and separate dsp system.

The Kef Blades must sound great. Maybe even better? I saved myself the search for a dac, preamp, amplifiers and room correction. However this can be a lot fun to.
I'm very happy with my choice. And in comparison with my previous setup this is a huge step up.

Great that you are enjoying your Genelec setup! It must be tremendous listening

!

 

[EdW]

You dont need robust stand for Genelec speakers since isopods are included.
Then you save a ton of money on Amplication and dsp and cabling.
You can also eq them very easily for more forgiving response.

If i have unlimited funds i still would get Genelecs cause their room correction is very good and + sub integration is just perfect.
Would love to hear Blades to see if they are better, but on paper they dont offer anything more.

Kef did fantastic job with design, i imagine design also boost sales quite a lot.

I already had a Topping D90 DAC - pretty capable by the reckoning of most. And a Raspberry pi4 using free Volumio with the DSP feature for room correction and/or eq - actually very low cost at around £90 for the pi4 + cables. Speaker cables and DAC to monoblock power amp cables from Blue Jeans. The one luxury 2 March Audio monoblock power amps with the 1ET7040 modules and regulated 70V supples Runs perhaps 10deg over ambient temperature, No hiss on speaker output even with ear almost touching driver against a room background spl of around 27dB ‘C’ weighted. Loudspeaker drive units last for 15-20 minimum usually. Cool running electronics may also last this long, But the electronics are low cost compared to the speakers and course easy to replace - I suspect that even as an EE I might struggle to make repairs