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Lute Music and Other Early Music: Stunning Recordings We Love

Music707

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Oh, the CD cover art of GLOSSA Cabinet version is very beautiful, I like it!

The same for the YouTube background image; I assume it was made/drawn by an image generation AI/Chat-GPT??;)
The sound quality of the YouTube clip is also excellent, almost identical to the original tracks which I download-purchased at magnatune.com in September 2004.

I once contacted with Edward Martin, through magnatune.com, inquiring the hardware/software and venue for recording of this wonderful album. He kindly and simply responded that they recorded at his small home studio using commonly available stereo microphone and his PC. If it is true, Just amazing! I personally assume he (they) would have much advanced recording setups, though...

If you like, you may still purchase the album here at magnatune.com site (the cover art has been changed; I like better the original classical/traditional one).

Thank you very much for your assessment of the audio quality of the video and for sharing the nice backgrund story on the recording!
 

Aynsley

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Over the past few weeks I've been enjoying virtuoso Masaaki Suzuki's performances of Bach's keyboard music. I noticed that his Well-Tempered Clavier was recorded in the chapel of Kobe Shoin Women's University, and recalled the message you posted with details of the chapel in the Kiyoharu Art Colony.

I believe Suzuki is a native of Kobe, Japan, and will no doubt be familiar with the acoustics of the Shoin chapel, but after spending thirty minutes looking for photos of the venue, and examining them closely, my impression is that the 'new' chapel would be a poor location for an audio recording.

I have no technical knowledge of room acoustics, so can't tell why some artists (or perhaps audio engineers) choose specific places, especially when it comes to performances on instruments (such as the lute) that could be carried and played almost anywhere.

@dualazmak with your pro-level sound analysis software, are you able to identify subtleties such as delay in sound reflected off walls, floor and ceiling?
 
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dualazmak

dualazmak

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Hello @Aynsley,

Very nice hearing from you again!

Actually, I do not have professional-level acoustic analysis gears and software at all; I only have one measurement microphone BEHRINGER ECM8000 and I use audio analysis software Adobe Audition 3.0.1, REW, Audacity, MusicScope, etc. I believe we need professional acoustic engineer(s) having much advanced gears and software for the intensive measurement and analysis of acoustic environments/subtleties in recording venues.

Just for your reference, however, you may find here on my project thread one of my really naive acoustic measurement/tuning procedures identifying a wall causing subtle acoustic reflection and standing wave.

I really thank you for your message related to the City Kobe, my/our home town!! Myself and my wife were born in Kobe, and we spent earlier half of our life in Kobe, beautiful havor city. We and Masaaki Suzuki are the almost same generation (only three-year difference) spent our "springtime of life/adolescence" in Kobe.

And, yes, we are very familiar with SHOIN Women's University (founded in 1892) as well as SHOIN Junior & Senior High School, both are Anglican Communion Christian University and School. My high school, Kobe High School (Hyogo Prefectural number-one high school in Kobe), is/was located very near, 15-min walking distance, from SHOIN University and SHOIN High School.

I assume you are already aware of the Chapel web page and the PDF on "Le Grande Orgue de KOBE SHOIN" manifactured by Marc GARNIER.

I believe I should write you more through PM communication, hopefully within the coming a few days in this weekend...
 

Aynsley

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I've been returning again and again to Genzo Takehisa's Aeolian recordings, especially Le Rossignol-en-Amour (AEO-513) and Sefauchi's Farewell (AEO-501). Both the recordings and the performances are impeccable, and a delight to listen to.
I was listening to Sefauchi's Farewell (AEO-501) for perhaps the sixth or seventh time when I noticed the similarity of the first track "Pavana Lachrimae" and John Dowland's "Lachrymae". I then did something I should have done a long time ago, which is read maestro Genzo Takehisa's liner notes. He notes that the piece is Sweelinck's arrangement of Dowland's famous lute piece. That surprised me, as I had always thought of Sweelinck as coming before Dowland, which just goes to show my ignorance.

A few minutes' of browsing on Wikipedia and other sources opened my eyes to the stature of Sweelinck as an innovative composer. I had no idea he originated the fugue style that was later perfected by Bach.

 
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dualazmak

dualazmak

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Yes, I always feel the same about JP Sweelinck, even though I have only these 6 CDs containing music by Sweelinck;
WS00005670.JPG


It is really interesting that Glenn Gould had great interest on the music of Sweelinck together with his passions on Orlando Gibbons and William Byrd (please refer to my post #141). You can hear Gould plays Sweelinck on YouTube;


BTW, the melodyline of "Flow, my tears" or "Lachrimae, or Seven Teares" by John Dowland became exceptionally popular in that era and afterwards, and many composers and musicians incorporated it in their music;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flow,_my_tears
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lachrimæ,_or_Seven_Teares

I can hear the melancholic melody of "Lachrimae" in so many tracks of my early music library, as you may assume.
 
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dualazmak

dualazmak

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Hello again @Aynsley,

Your above post #165 on Jan Pieterszoon Sweelinck just reminded me one nice CD performed by Alsfedler Vokarenensemble;

FESTICHE MOTETTEN ALTER MEISTER (FESTIVAL MOTETS FROM THE 16TH CENRTURY)
Alsfelder Vokalenemseble, Wolfgang Helbich, Director; CD 313 012 H1 Koch Schwann:
WS00005673.JPG


All the tracks are so beautifully performed, highly recommended.

The famous "Ave, dulcissima Maria" by Carlo Gesualdo is also included in this album; I have the same performed by The Tallis Scholars (CD GIM015, Gimell Records), and also by Oxford Camerata (8.550742 Naxos). All the three performances of this wonderful Gesualdo's sacred music are really nice in a little bit of different approach and number of singers.

At least for myself, the Alsfedler Vocalenensemble's performance sounds really (most) heartfelt partly because of the slow tempo (6:15 here vs. 4:16 of Tallis Scholars', 4:39 of Oxford Camerata's) and the more singers in each part with a little bit of farther microphone position giving richer in hall tone and reverberation.
 

pma

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Throughout my long years of enthusiasm in classical music and Hi-Fi audio, I have always deeply loved lute music
Though not exactly lute, but koto and schakuhachi, do you know this? (Bought in Japan many years ago)

8F9ADECB-6485-4008-B301-FE2CB962B460.jpeg
 
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dualazmak

dualazmak

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Hello @pma, welcome to this niche thread!

I am very happy to know that you came to Japan.

I don't know the specific CD you mentioned, but as you can imagine, I am very much familiar with the sound, music and performance of Japanese instruments such as shakuhachi, koto, shamisen, ohdaiko (Japanese big drums), shinobue (wooden flute/piccolo, biwa (a type of lute origin, similar to sitar), etc.

Have you ever heard "November Steps" composed by Toru Takemitsu, which is very famous for its unique collaboration of shakuhachi and biwa with full orchestra?


Another example is the unique collaboration of Japanese drums and Tsugaru shamisen, which I've shared here and here as an "audio sampler/reference track" for passive transient soundcheck and tuning;
 
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Aynsley

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Perhaps this message belongs in the Bach topic, but it's not so much about Bach, as the quality of some recordings.

Reccently I've been listening to numerous interpretations of the Well-Tempered Clavier. The liner notes make no mention of microphone placement, so I have no idea why the soundstage of what should be a single keyboard instrument, harpsichord or piano, can be so variable.

One example is Sviatoslav Richter's magnificent 4-CD set on the Alto label. I don't have the box set and have been listening on Apple Music lossless. The volume of the recordings varies from barely audible to very loud, perhaps because they were made at different times. What's more disturbing is that sometimes the low notes appear to be coming from one channel and the high notes from the other (I'm using Moondrop Blessing 3 IEMs). It's almost as if the audio engineer placed one microphone above the bass strings and the other above the treble. It sounds so odd that I'm wondering if it's a monoaural recording that has been processed digitally to add depth.

There are other recordings, such as those by Zuzana Ruzickova on the Erato label, which exhibit the opposite phenomenon: treble notes on the left and bass notes on the right. Could this have something to do with the sound being reflected from the lid of the instrument and propagating from there to the microphones?

Masaaki Suzuki's recordings on the BIS label are wonderfully clear and precise. Again, there's a spread between low on the left and high on the right, but it sounds very natural, and I get the impression I'm standing behind the performer and hearing what he would have heard, which is a very satisfying and intimate experience.

This division of low/high is something that I associate with organ performances, in which the pipes can be many metres apart or, occasionally, at opposite ends of the church or chapel. (I'm thinking of Power-Biggs multi-channel recordings on four organs in the Cathedral of Freiburg.)

I'm struggling to put my thoughts into words. I do hope contributors to this forum can decipher what I'm trying to say.
 

JaMaSt

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I keyed the start to the performance in the above video. But there are some very interesting points about whether or not Bach actually wrote any music for a solo lute.

Listen around the 5 min mark regarding this.
 
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dualazmak

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Reccently I've been listening to numerous interpretations of the Well-Tempered Clavier. The liner notes make no mention of microphone placement, so I have no idea why the soundstage of what should be a single keyboard instrument, harpsichord or piano, can be so variable.

Thank you for your interesting topic which would attract attentions of not only myself but also many people visiting this thread.

Excellent recordings of solo piano (and harpsichord/cembalo) music and their HiFi audio reproduction have been one of my major concerns throughout my long-year music and audio enjoyment since I used to play piano quite often, classical ones from Bach to Debussy, just for my and family enjoyments. I also have been to so many wonderful piano concerts in Japan and abroad.

You would please visit my posts here and here on my audio project thread regarding my "audio sampler/reference tracks" for piano solo and harpsichord, respectively. In those two posts I rather intensively discussed "stunning recordings" of five (5) piano tracks and three (3) harpsichord tracks.

I fully agree with you that even in these "stunning" recorded tracks, the recording venue, microphone selections and settings, mixing/mastering engineering/preference, are all different with each other; we cannot tell, of course, which one would be the best. I (we) can only say that this type of recording would very nicely fit for my personal preference...

By the way, I fully agree with you that the total recording quality should be always stay consistent throughout of any specific CD or LP "albums", at least.

I also agree with you that in many recorded tracks we have very limited information on the microphone selections/settings and other recording engineering; I always "wonder" and "guess", like you do, what and how would have been the recording/mixing technology and engineering for the specific music track I listened to.

Let me share with you one recent typical example case.

On the thread entitled "The Truth about many "Audiophile" Piano Recordings", I shared in my post here the wonderful performance of Andras Schiff playing Bach Overture and Suites in French Style in B Minor BWV831.
IMHO, this performance (and the recording) is one of the "World Music Heritages", indeed.
I used to stick to Glenn Gould's wonderful performance of BWV831 for the long period, but now this Schiff's BWV831 occupies the top position on my preference list (having 11 performances by various pianists in my library) for BWV831.

Very much interestingly, however, I (we) hardly see microphone(s) at least in the video image even though the recording quality is amazing and stunning.

Accordingly thereafter, we discussed a lot about possible microphone(s) and their settings in the posts #171, #174, #178, #180, #186, #189, #190, #191, and #193. Our final possible consensus after these interesting discussions was that the splendid recording engineer would have used tiny PZM microphone(s) (or so called boundary microphones) inside of the Steinway piano. The technology and engineering of microphones looks now far beyond of my very limited knowledge, I assume.

In any way, excellent recording of piano/harpsichord is always a great challenge for recording engineers, and the HiFi reproduction of such recorded tracks is always great challenge for our home audio systems.

Edit:
As @mSpot kindly shared here,,,
Regarding the "Andras Schiff Live Performance in Bachfest 2010 Leipzig", you can find the entire video on YouTube;
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLhIP1CNbYhVObXv7ByHmE5oETjj6RXyAN
and
The concert was filmed and released by EuroArts, and available from various sources including Apple Music:
https://music.apple.com/ag/album/andrás-schiff-plays-bach-live-from-bachfest-2010-visual/1595036780
I am happy finding in the ending credit that "A production of EuroArets Music International in coproduction with NHK, Japan".
 
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dualazmak

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I keyed the start to the performance in the above video. But there are some very interesting points about whether or not Bach actually wrote any music for a solo lute.

Listen around the 5 min mark regarding this.

Hello @JaMaSt, welcome to this niche thread!

Thank you for sharing very interesting and educational YouTube video link with us all.
This is my first time to actually listen to the sound of "Lautenwerck". The sound and performance are very much impressive for me.
 

MRC01

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.. sometimes the low notes appear to be coming from one channel and the high notes from the other (I'm using Moondrop Blessing 3 IEMs). It's almost as if the audio engineer placed one microphone above the bass strings and the other above the treble. ... There are other recordings, such as those by Zuzana Ruzickova on the Erato label, which exhibit the opposite phenomenon: treble notes on the left and bass notes on the right. ... Masaaki Suzuki's recordings on the BIS label are wonderfully clear and precise. Again, there's a spread between low on the left and high on the right, ...
Most piano recordings I have heard have this L-R asymmetry, some more than others. I agree that the subtle cases can sound natural. Listening to a live piano player, it often sounds like this depending on your position and distance.
 
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dualazmak

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Hello friends,

A little bit to be out of the scope of this thread, but for your possible reference (and interests), yesterday I posted on my multichannel audio project thread;
- Reproduction and listening/hearing/feeling sensations to 16 Hz (organ) sound with my DSP-based multichannel multi-SP-driver multi-amplifier fully active stereo audio system having big-heavy active L&R sub-woofers: #782
 

Philbo King

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Edit on August 25, 2022
The title of this thread has been modified into: Lute Music and Other Early Music: Stunning Recordings We Love.


Throughout my long years of enthusiasm in classical music and Hi-Fi audio, I have always deeply loved lute music.

Stunning recording of lute music, therefore, is one of the many major targets for the recently (provisionally) completed my multichannel multi-amplifier project. As you may agree, nice recordings of lute music always have wide-spread and well balanced frequency spectrum over ca. 25 Hz - 25 kHz, and which is always a kind of nice challenge to our Hi-Fi audio system.

While fully enjoying wonderful sound of lute music with my recently completed multichannel multi-amplifier system, I decided to start this new thread entitled "Lute Music: Stunning Recordings We Love" even though I fully understand it would be quite a small niche field in classical music.

Here, I would highly appreciate your participation on not only lute music but also archlute, theorbo and vihuera music.

Edited to add: Let's include "Lute Songs" also!

With my hearty respects to the Canadian lutenist Michel Cardin, let me start this thread by introduction to his outstanding performance and recording in a set of twelve (12) CDs of Silvius Leopold Weiss's Complete London Manuscript for Lute.
View attachment 117816

In 2006, I purchased these 12 CDs directly from Michel Cardin in Canada after wonderful communication with him. Very fortunately, these 12 CDs are now finally available in Amazon;
https://www.amazon.com/Silvius-Leop...&keywords=Michel+Cardin&qid=1615548819&sr=8-1
and elsewhere.
You can also hear many sampler tracks of this really amazing 12-CD album in YouTube, just for example;
I had a guy come into my studio and make a lute recording. He was quite skilled and it was a very pleasant experience. I wish I had kept a copy.
 
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dualazmak

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Hello friends,

Today, I eventually noticed that I have not yet shared this wonderful performance and recording by Paul Berget entitled "SL Weiss on 11 Strings"; I download purchased in around 2006 at Magnatune site, and the album is fortunately still alive there and you can download-purchase. Really wonderful performance and stunning recording quality; highly recommended!
Edit: If you would have serious difficulty in getting the intact album, please simply PM me.
WS00006601.JPG

Edit:
I found it is also on YouTube;
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?app=desktop&list=OLAK5uy_kSgkqqsfh2r_MPj3xVHf6MES21QMUKnJQ
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCg8hZFNVZz1QUYWyP2oxLUw
and also on Apple Music;
BTW, I recently completed a new ASIO/VASIO routing on my multichannel audio rig using the VB-Audio Matrix shared in the audio project thread (ref. here, here and here). And today, I was listening to Paul's amazing Weiss album above (he played 11-string guitar fully tuned as 11-string lute) repeatedly for final confirmation of the new ASIO/VASIO multichannel routing.
WS00006600.JPG


Really stunning sound quality I can hear for sublime performance of 11-string guitar fully tuned as 11-string lute giving tears in my eyes; what more could I (we) ask for??

Ref. https://www.bergetmusic.com/recordings.htm
WS00006599.JPG


Edit: If you would have serious difficulty in getting the intact album, please simply PM me.
 
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