Puzzled by the difference in sound between coaxial and optical connections

[Paperkite]

Hello everyone,

I use the Marantz PM6006 with either of these two sources:

- IFI Zen Streamer connected to the amp via Fiio - LR-RCA1 Coaxial Digital 0.5m cable streaming music from Tidal

- Panasonic TV TX-50DX750B via optical cable streaming from Youtube (internal app)

Ifi Streamer sounds much warmer, with slightly subdued midrange and highs. The detail in the highs is there, but the voices sound a bit in the back and veiled.

TV via optical cable, which is sounding a bit more clinical, with subdued bass but more midrange and treble, and voices sound just about right, more present, closer.

How can that be? I use it on "source direct" mode. Can the internal DAC CS4398 render the signals differently?

Can you tell me what could it be causing this?

Thanks a lot!

 

[threni]

Hello everyone,

I use the Marantz PM6006 with either of these two sources:

- IFI Zen Streamer connected to the amp via Fiio - LR-RCA1 Coaxial Digital 0.5m cable streaming music from Tidal

- Panasonic TV TX-50DX750B via optical cable streaming from Youtube (internal app)

Ifi Streamer sounds much warmer, with slightly subdued midrange and highs. The detail in the highs is there, but the voices sound a bit in the back and veiled.

TV via optical cable, which is sounding a bit more clinical, with subdued bass but more midrange and treble, and voices sound just about right, more present, closer.

How can that be? I use it on "source direct" mode. Can the internal DAC CS4398 render the signals differently?

Can you tell me what could it be causing this?

Thanks a lot!

It's hard to believe lossy music through one set of hardware sounds different to lossless music through a different set!

 

[voodooless]

There are so many variables here besides optical vs coax, that basically, all bets are off.

 

[RosalieTheDog]

YouTube is not Tidal, there is probably internal resampling in the TV, ...

 

[raindance]

This is like comparing apples with cats.

 

[fpitas]

This is like comparing apples with cats.

But I like both!

 

[voodooless]

But I like both!

But do they taste the same?

 

[fpitas]

But do they taste the same?

Once you get past the fur?

 

[voodooless]

Once you get past the fur?

Whatever floats your boat... I'm not eating cats

 

[fpitas]

Whatever floats your boat... I'm not eating cats

I was talking about the local apples

 

[voodooless]

I was talking about the local apples

There are other options:

 

[notsodeadlizard]

Both used media (coax and optical) are the same S/PDIF with the same single synchronous serial data stream combined with the clock.
But the low-level quality of each stream is determined by source's implementation.
Clock is recovered from a stream at receiver side (your Marantz in your case).
The stream forming mechanism and the clock recovery mechanism (working at receiver side) can't be perfect, there is nothing perfect in this world.
So, there is a jitter anyway.
And these jitters are different in both cases because the sources are different and the qualities of streams at low-level are different.
Everything is quite obvious here.
In some cases, source-receiver combinations can be so unfortunate that it is completely impossible to listen to.

 

[TonyJZX]

i often find that when i drink dasani from the bottle it tastes different from bud light from a can

 

[fpitas]

i often find that when i drink dasani from the bottle it tastes different from bud light from a can

You need a new thread for that.

 

[voodooless]

Both used media (coax and optical) are the same S/PDIF with the same single synchronous serial data stream combined with the clock.
But the low-level quality of each stream is determined by source's implementation.
Clock is recovered from a stream at receiver side (your Marantz in your case).
The stream forming mechanism and the clock recovery mechanism (working at receiver side) can't be perfect, there is nothing perfect in this world.
So, there is a jitter anyway.
And these jitters are different in both cases because the sources are different and the qualities of streams at low-level are different.
Everything is quite obvious here.
In some cases, source-receiver combinations can be so unfortunate that it is completely impossible to listen to.

I highly doubt jitter is the (primary) issue here. We're working with two totally different source devices, two totally different music sources. We have no way to know if it's even the same master. And if it's normal Youtube, not Youtube Music, you can be sure they did something to the sound. Then there are the TVs that are notorious for delivering sub-standard resampling. And some settings in the TV may also fuck things up. So there are like half a dozen things more likely than jitter.

 

[notsodeadlizard]

I highly doubt jitter is the (primary) issue here. We're working with two totally different source devices, two totally different music sources. We have no way to know if it's even the same master. And if it's normal Youtube, not Youtube Music, you can be sure they did something to the sound. Then there are the TVs that are notorious for delivering sub-standard resampling. And some settings in the TV may also fuck things up. So there are like half a dozen things more likely than jitter.

Of course, but that doesn't change what was said.

 

[TonyJZX]

yeah i would never take optical out of a tv seriously

But to the OP you have basically cooked two different meals and served on on a plate and one in bowl and asked by things taste better out of a bowl.

you need to be testing the same source, ie the same dac with the same music material, ie. redbook cd, level matched and ABX

anything else is bad science

marantz make an good amp w/ ok dacs and really, you should hear no difference.

 

[ahofer]

There are other options:

Don't I know it. Those are hairless, but I have a close cousin - a Cornish Rex (see my avatar). You can often see their skin pigmentation and they have the same bat ears and rat tails. But kept their undercoats. They tend to be very active and affectionate (partly because they are cold).

 

[ahofer]

Of course, but that doesn't change what was said.

That's an odd comment. Nothing changes what anybody already said. But if your contention is that it was jitter, that's quite unlikely.

DEMO / MUSINGS: Let's listen to some jitter simulations with sideband distortions...

A blog for audiophiles about more objective topics. Measurements of audio gear. Reasonable, realistic, no snakeoil assessment of sound, and equipment.

archimago.blogspot.com

 

[Deleted member 48726]

There are other options:

I think you wrote Rat instead of Cat on Google Images..