Denon AVR-X3600H AV Receiver Review

[GXAlan]

Hi everyone!
I am quoting Amir's review and hope that anyone can shed some light for me...

The easier way to think of this is that the built in amps clipped at 1.5V which means

108W into 8
167W into 4*

Here the amplifier couldn’t double down into 4, so it’s a limitation of current — but if you have a pre-out and enable the internal amp, when the internal amps clip, so will the pre-out.

100W into 8 is a lot of power.

This is why I think it’s way more important to measure SINAD at lower voltage when it comes to preamplifiers/processors instead of DACs.

 

[peng]

but if you have a pre-out and enable the internal amp, when the internal amps clip, so will the pre-out.

That is one of the very few things that I think Amir is wrong at least in practical sense. The power amp may start to clip at that point, but the pre out did not. Amir just have his own way of defining clipping. Anyway, I failed to convince him that he's wrong but it is obvious that lots of asr members have been led to believe their Denon avrs could only output 1.4 V, yet measurements show they could output 2 V with SINAD >75 dB, often higher than some AV processors did, such as the AV7705.

 

[Taso]

Hi, I finally got my nice 3600 and I'm selling the 3300. I only use preamp outputs. I looked at the various menus but it's not clear to me how to disable all the internal amplifiers. can you give me a hand? Thanks again!

 

[peng]

Hi, I finally got my nice 3600 and I'm selling the 3300. I only use preamp outputs. I looked at the various menus but it's not clear to me how to disable all the internal amplifiers. can you give me a hand? Thanks again!

Like the 4300, 4400, and 4500, you can only disconnect the front left and right channel amplifiers from the pre outs. If you want to disconnect all of the internal amplifiers you have go with the 3700, 4700 or newer models.

 

[Taso]

Like the 4300, 4400, and 4500, you can only disconnect the front left and right channel amplifiers from the pre outs. If you want to disconnect all of the internal amplifiers you have go with the 3700, 4700 or newer models.

hi, it's fine to just disconnect the front channels. That is, when disconnected, the performance of the DAC relating to the front channels is at the top, if I haven't misunderstood! How do you do? Can you give me a little help? Thank you

 

[peng]

hi, it's fine to just disconnect the front channels. That is, when disconnected, the performance of the DAC relating to the front channels is at the top, if I haven't misunderstood! How do you do? Can you give me a little help? Thank you

The instruction should be under the Amp Assign menu, that is under Manual setup:

Once in, you should see something like the following screeshot that was taken on my X4400H, the one for the X3600H should be similar.
Don't expect hearing a difference though, after disconnecting the internal amps, because a) very few people can hear a difference between a few dB or even 20 dB SINAD difference in this case, and b) if I remember right, you will be using an external amp that has much higher distortions anyway.

 

[Taso]

The instruction should be under the Amp Assign menu, that is under Manual setup:

View attachment 314629
Una volta dentro, dovresti vedere qualcosa come il seguente screeshot che è stato scattato sul mio X4400H, quello per l'X3600H dovrebbe essere simile.
Non aspettarti di sentire una differenza però, dopo aver scollegato gli amplificatori interni, perché a) pochissime persone possono sentire una differenza tra pochi dB o anche 20 dB SINAD di differenza in questo caso, e b) se ricordo bene, utilizzerai comunque un amplificatore esterno che ha comunque distorsioni molto più elevate.

View attachment 314627

The instruction should be under the Amp Assign menu, that is under Manual setup:

View attachment 314629
Once in, you should see something like the following screeshot that was taken on my X4400H, the one for the X3600H should be similar.
Don't expect hearing a difference though, after disconnecting the internal amps, because a) very few people can hear a difference between a few dB or even 20 dB SINAD difference in this case, and b) if I remember right, you will be using an external amp that has much higher distortions anyway.

thank you, you were very kind. then in the "pre-out" section I select front. I copied your setup. only external amplifiers are used. I certainly don't feel any difference but I like being set up like this! Thank you

 

[Taso]

Hi, I had a question. In the 3600 (I presume also in the other Denon) how does the volume work? Is it a digital volume? In which position on the block diagram is it located? In my 3600 I only enter digitally...so how does the volume affect my digital signal (digit coax)? Thank you and I apologize if I explained myself poorly.

 

[peng]

Hi, I had a question. In the 3600 (I presume also in the other Denon) how does the volume work? Is it a digital volume? In which position on the block diagram is it located? In my 3600 I only enter digitally...so how does the volume affect my digital signal (digit coax)? Thank you and I apologize if I explained myself poorly.

You can see the block diagram in the Maximo video that is for the 4800. The 3600's is similar, same volume control chip, and in the same positions, that is connected to the output of the dac via the electronic switch that they call "Selector" in the attached diagram. So, you can see that the volume control IC's input is analog.

 

[Taso]

Thanks again for the replies.
If I wanted to get the front L and R digital signal out of my x3600h where should I "attach" it?
I have the service manual for my old AVR x3300w... but I can't find the one for the x3600h, my current AVR. Thanks for any help

Thanks

 

[Taso]

Hi, I bought the service manual, "only" 17USD! To have the digital output it seems you cannot have it after the volume. I could be happy with it without the Denon volume control. It seems you have to take the i2s signal and convert it to spdif.......

 

[peng]

Thanks again for the replies.
If I wanted to get the front L and R digital signal out of my x3600h where should I "attach" it?
I have the service manual for my old AVR x3300w... but I can't find the one for the x3600h, my current AVR. Thanks for any help

Thanks

What are you trying to achieve, or gain?

 

[Taso]

One front L/R digital output. Better if after the volume of the denon but I understand that this is not possible.
I would like it anyway. I want to use audyssey followed by a digital crossover and multi-amplification of a pair of speakers.
3 Amplifiers.

thanks

 

[Taso]

Hi, i sold my 3300 to have the akm dacs.
I therefore bought a 3600 because it was known they were 100% AKM.
I don't see anything with markio akm. Why? It's possible? ( I'm a bit sad.
I could have saved myself 400 euros! The serice manual is confusing, it speaks and mentions akm 4458 and at the same time PCM 5100.
Thanks

 

[peng]

Hi, I saw my 3300 to have the akm dacs.
I therefore bought a 3600 because it was known they were 100% AKM.
I don't see anything with markio akm. Why? It's possible? ( I'm a bit sad.
I could have saved myself 400 euros! The serice manual is confusing, it speaks and mentions akm 4458 and at the same time PCM 5100.
Thanks

If you have the SM, you should see that it has the AK4458. It also has the PC5100 for zone2.

 

[Taso]

Thanks for the reply. In the service manual, in the blocks diagram, it mentions AKM4458, but in the other diagrams and on the pcb drawings.. I always read only pcm5100.
Apart from the service manual (which I have), ...I opened the denon.
I don't see anything about AKM. but I see these two ....PC5100....
I think I should find AKM written here...but unfortunately not.
I attach photos (burr brown pcm5100a). Maybe the two pcm5100s are for zone two and other things and the ak4558s are somewhere else? maybe other pcb side?
Thanks

 

[peng]

Thanks for the reply. In the service manual, in the blocks diagram, it mentions AKM4458, but in the other diagrams and on the pcb drawings.. I always read only pcm5100.
Apart from the service manual (which I have), ...I opened the denon.
I don't see anything about AKM. but I see these two ....PC5100....
I think I should find AKM written here...but unfortunately not.
I attach photos (burr brown pcm5100a). Maybe the two pcm5100s are for zone two and other things and the ak4558s are somewhere else? maybe other pcb side?
Thanks

The attached diagram clearly show the AK4458s are the main dac. The PCM5100 are zone 2 and lego. There is no maybe, the main dacs are definitely the AK4458. You can also look at the level diagrams where you may find it easier to see the functions of AK4458 and PCM5100. I don't remember the page number but you can do a keyword search for "level" to find those block diagrams.

Let me know if you cannot find them

 

[Taso]

Thanks, I'll check the SM better.
But I wonder: where are the AKMs, physically, inside the Denon?
they should all be close by being connected to the same "Big Chip".
Maybe under the card and therefore not visible?
Thank you.

 

[peng]

Thanks, I'll check the SM better.
But I wonder: where are the AKMs, physically, inside the Denon?
they should all be close by being connected to the same "Big Chip".
Maybe under the card and therefore not visible?
Thank you.

The main dac board is most likely not visible without removing some boards.

 

[Taso]

Yes, you are perfectly right.
FOUND IT!
....after 1.5 hours of reading the whole SM and looking for the DACs on the PCB drawings...found it!
Now I can go to sleep.
They are very hidden, they cannot be physically seen. It is a card approximately 15x15cm in vertical position (Side).
I can probably get all the signals above the connectors.
When I see them physically...I kiss them!

In reality I may not even have to see them.
I'm sure I'll find everything directly on the connectors between the akm board and the digital main board, without dismantling anything.
Greetings! and goodnight!