Best Power Amp trying to recreate Audio Note Cobra experience

[yenot777]

Hello everyone and happy holiday season.
I'd love to hear opinions as I am looking for a Power Amp. I heard quite a bit of popular setups but one of them imprinted in my head having perfect sound for me. It was Audio Note Cobra tube amp and Audio note speakers. I honestly do not have such a high budget for both of those and want to ask if that is possible to make that sound without splurging $10K.
If someone listened those would you mind to share your opinions?
I own B&W 703 S2 speakers rated at 89db sensitivity and a Technics SL-1500C turntable. I used to have a Roksan K3 power amp which worked perfectly fine but you know that sound of AudioNote setup has never left my head.

Anyways, I'd love to hear any inputs from you guys since you're much more expereinced than me here.

Thank you a lot for reading.

 

[Roland68]

Hello everyone and happy holiday season.
I'd love to hear opinions as I am looking for a Power Amp. I heard quite a bit of popular setups but one of them imprinted in my head having perfect sound for me. It was Audio Note Cobra tube amp and Audio note speakers. I honestly do not have such a high budget for both of those and want to ask if that is possible to make that sound without splurging $10K.
If someone listened those would you mind to share your opinions?
I own B&W 703 S2 speakers rated at 89db sensitivity and a Technics SL-1500C turntable. I used to have a Roksan K3 power amp which worked perfectly fine but you know that sound of AudioNote setup has never left my head.

Anyways, I'd love to hear any inputs from you guys since you're much more expereinced than me here.

Thank you a lot for reading.

It should be clear to you that the Audio Note Cobra tube amplifier consciously and intentionally imposes its own "sound" on the music. You won't achieve this with conventional, well-measuring amplifiers. Even "terrible" recordings can sound acceptable on this amp.
The same applies to the speakers. Here too, Audio Note takes an approach that deviates from usual loudspeakers. Damping is largely avoided. Instead, the housings are built to optimize resonance and are included in the overall tuning of the loudspeaker. It is not surprising that it is not MDF that is used, but types of wood like those used in acoustic instrument making. A few crossover components with first-order frequency separation support the concept.
This results in a very lively and dynamic character, which is further supported by the large front surface of these speakers and fits very well with tube amplifiers of this type.

I can understand why I like this sound, but it has nothing to do with an uninfluenced and faithful reproduction. I know some HiFi enthusiasts who have 2 different systems for this very reason.

If these devices have impressed you so much, then it's better to save money and, with a little perseverance, get used components.
I've seen enough people in my life who were looking for something comparable because the original was too expensive for them (hi-fi, cars, bicycles, computers, clothing, etc.). None of them were happy with it, but in the end they still invested a lot of money and even more time in it. And sometimes they even paid extra.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

… and get the room too, where you had the listening experience.

 

[Schollaudio]

This is always tough and the amp price isn't really terrible considering.

If you can DIY maybe find some SEAS A26RE4 and use a nice Wavecore TW030WA12. They have good potential for easy integration. Maybe you'll be happy there or look for a modern Dynaco ST70 variation and add a SHIIT preamp.

You're still looking at $3k.

Also find a pair of Dynaco A25 speakers for $100.00. or even Yamaha made some sleeper NS series speakers in the 80s NS 5 or NS 6 or whatever. You might like those for a low price too.

 

[DVDdoug]

A "high fidelity" amplifier isn't supposed to have a particular sound and most good amplifiers (tube or solid state) meet that goal. A McIntosh tube amp will be "transparent" and sound exactly like any other good amp. It's much cheaper & easer to make a good solid state amp, especially with power amplifiers because tube power amps need an output transformer and it can add distortion.

If a tube amp has a particular sound, another amp will sound different so you have to listen for yourself to decide if you like that particular sound.

There are software plug-ins that can simulate various tube distortion/saturation but they are designed for use with a DAW application in audio production and they aren't convenient for reproduction. The most practical way to use one would be to "process" all of your digital files to add the "tube sound". (It would be a lot cheaper than buying a tube amp.)

The goal is the same with hi-fi speakers... To accurately reproduce the sound. But overall, speakers aren't as good and in real life every speaker will sound different. Probably most of the "sound' you remember was from the speakers.

And, speakers do sound different in different rooms.

but you know that sound of AudioNote setup has never left my head.

I'm sure you have a strong memory of the sound and it made an emotional impression on you, but our short-term memory of sound is better than long term. For example, if you are listening for subtle differences in and A/B or ABX test, the differences are most-easily heard with quick-switching and it can be hard to know which one you are listening to the next day, or the next week

 

[MaxBuck]

I'm sure you have a strong memory of the sound and it made an emotional impression on you

This is where that doohickey from Men in Black would come in handy.

 

[yenot777]

It should be clear to you that the Audio Note Cobra tube amplifier consciously and intentionally imposes its own "sound" on the music. You won't achieve this with conventional, well-measuring amplifiers. Even "terrible" recordings can sound acceptable on this amp.
The same applies to the speakers. Here too, Audio Note takes an approach that deviates from usual loudspeakers. Damping is largely avoided. Instead, the housings are built to optimize resonance and are included in the overall tuning of the loudspeaker. It is not surprising that it is not MDF that is used, but types of wood like those used in acoustic instrument making. A few crossover components with first-order frequency separation support the concept.
This results in a very lively and dynamic character, which is further supported by the large front surface of these speakers and fits very well with tube amplifiers of this type.

I can understand why I like this sound, but it has nothing to do with an uninfluenced and faithful reproduction. I know some HiFi enthusiasts who have 2 different systems for this very reason.

If these devices have impressed you so much, then it's better to save money and, with a little perseverance, get used components.
I've seen enough people in my life who were looking for something comparable because the original was too expensive for them (hi-fi, cars, bicycles, computers, clothing, etc.). None of them were happy with it, but in the end they still invested a lot of money and even more time in it. And sometimes they even paid extra.

That all makes sense. Thank you for putting an effort and understanding.

 

[yenot777]

This is always tough and the amp price isn't really terrible considering.

If you can DIY maybe find some SEAS A26RE4 and use a nice Wavecore TW030WA12. They have good potential for easy integration. Maybe you'll be happy there or look for a modern Dynaco ST70 variation and add a SHIIT preamp.

You're still looking at $3k.

Also find a pair of Dynaco A25 speakers for $100.00. or even Yamaha made some sleeper NS series speakers in the 80s NS 5 or NS 6 or whatever. You might like those for a low price too.

Okay, I'll research those. I actually have Schiit Saga+ with a tube. Will try those. Thank you

 

[yenot777]

A "high fidelity" amplifier isn't supposed to have a particular sound and most good amplifiers (tube or solid state) meet that goal. A McIntosh tube amp will be "transparent" and sound exactly like any other good amp. It's much cheaper & easer to make a good solid state amp, especially with power amplifiers because tube power amps need an output transformer and it can add distortion.

If a tube amp has a particular sound, another amp will sound different so you have to listen for yourself to decide if you like that particular sound.

There are software plug-ins that can simulate various tube distortion/saturation but they are designed for use with a DAW application in audio production and they aren't convenient for reproduction. The most practical way to use one would be to "process" all of your digital files to add the "tube sound". (It would be a lot cheaper than buying a tube amp.)

The goal is the same with hi-fi speakers... To accurately reproduce the sound. But overall, speakers aren't as good and in real life every speaker will sound different. Probably most of the "sound' you remember was from the speakers.

And, speakers do sound different in different rooms.


I'm sure you have a strong memory of the sound and it made an emotional impression on you, but our short-term memory of sound is better than long term. For example, if you are listening for subtle differences in and A/B or ABX test, the differences are most-easily heard with quick-switching and it can be hard to know which one you are listening to the next day, or the next week

Interesting thoughts. Well, that narrows down to "have different sets and always play with the sound", which makes sense. Thank you for the response.

 

[Chrispy]

I'd think it's more likely the speakers rather than amp, but if both were tweaked hard to know. The Roksan is an integrated amp, is that what you're shopping for rather than power amp? What happened to the Roksan?

 

[AlfaNovember]

Years past, several of the AudioNote speakers were based on the Snell Acoustics Type E. You might be able to find a secondhand pair of Snells for easy money, although they will likely be ready for a refoam.

 

[yenot777]

I'd think it's more likely the speakers rather than amp, but if both were tweaked hard to know. The Roksan is an integrated amp, is that what you're shopping for rather than power amp? What happened to the Roksan?

I have a K3 Power Amp - nothing happened to it - it gives a very tight and crisp sound - no issues whatsoever. Very musical too but the sound of Audio Note had some magic when I listened to the setup. If I were to compare the feeling I had was sort of the sound "hugging" you especially in Jazz and Blues what I love to listen.

 

[yenot777]

I'd think it's more likely the speakers rather than amp, but if both were tweaked hard to know. The Roksan is an integrated amp, is that what you're shopping for rather than power amp? What happened to the Roksan?

Well, I listened the Audio Note speakers with NAD M33, Atoll AM200, and some model of Hegel. None of those gave that sound that Audio Note Cobra did - at least to my ears at that moment lol (referring to the previous comment that we have short memory which is indeed makes sense)

 

[Chrispy]

When I looked it up it came up as an integrated. So what pre do you use? Personally never had such an experience just due the amp, good luck. I'm much more thinking it's the room/speakers unless the amp has been tweaked (I prefer an amp that doesn't do that).

 

[yenot777]

When I looked it up it came up as an integrated. So what pre do you use? Personally never had such an experience just due the amp, good luck. I'm much more thinking it's the room/speakers unless the amp has been tweaked (I prefer an amp that doesn't do that).

I am pretty sure that it tweaked by the factory like @Roland68 pointed out above - they tune their amps/speakers to get a specific sound.
In terms of Pre - I use Schiit Saga+
Audio Note is an integrated amp and its DAC is honestly limited and assembled on an old microchip. I would not probably even use it

 

[Chrispy]

I am pretty sure that it tweaked by the factory like @Roland68 pointed out above - they tune their amps/speakers to get a specific sound.
In terms of Pre - I use Schiit Saga+
Audio Note is an integrated amp and its DAC is honestly limited and assembled on an old microchip. I would not probably even use it

Tuning/tweaking is just not what I look for. It's too limited IMO.

 

[Schollaudio]

Years past, several of the AudioNote speakers were based on the Snell Acoustics Type E. You might be able to find a secondhand pair of Snells for easy money, although they will likely be ready for a refoam.

I have Snell E3s and really like them but I upcycled them with more modern Vifa woofers with rubber surrounds and SEAS tweeters. I had the parts on hand and they dropped right in and REW measurements were surprisingly smooth and flat. They play all day long with a cheap class D amp and streamer.

 

[Mart68]

I have a K3 Power Amp - nothing happened to it - it gives a very tight and crisp sound - no issues whatsoever. Very musical too but the sound of Audio Note had some magic when I listened to the setup. If I were to compare the feeling I had was sort of the sound "hugging" you especially in Jazz and Blues what I love to listen.

I know what you mean and this is indeed the appeal of Audionote, it does, at least for some, enhance simple acoustic music. And it isn't just the loudspeakers.

Their loudspeaker's contribution to this is, I think, their uplift in FR in the midrange and their cabinet resonances in the mid-bass.

With the amplifier I'd suggest it's compression - the speakers are not that sensitive and the amps tend to deliver about 4 watts before clipping so compression sets in early.

How to do it on the cheap?

You can replicate the speaker FR with some more neutral speaker and EQ but the cabinet resonance will still be missing. Although as suggested old Snells are very similar to Audionote and can be found pretty cheap.

For the amplifier any low power single ended valve amp should do the compression thing, doesn't need to have an Audionote badge on it.

 

[yenot777]

I know what you mean and this is indeed the appeal of Audionote, it does, at least for some, enhance simple acoustic music. And it isn't just the loudspeakers.

Their loudspeaker's contribution to this is, I think, their uplift in FR in the midrange and their cabinet resonances in the mid-bass.

With the amplifier I'd suggest it's compression - the speakers are not that sensitive and the amps tend to deliver about 4 watts before clipping so compression sets in early.

How to do it on the cheap?

You can replicate the speaker FR with some more neutral speaker and EQ but the cabinet resonance will still be missing. Although as suggested old Snells are very similar to Audionote and can be found pretty cheap.

For the amplifier any low power single ended valve amp should do the compression thing, doesn't need to have an Audionote badge on it.

Great to hear that someone can share thoughts / understand and I really appreciate your input!
Do you think Primaluna Evo100 or let's say good tube 24W will make a trick? I can try and then experiment with the speakers.

 

[Mart68]

Great to hear that someone can share thoughts / understand and I really appreciate your input!
Do you think Primaluna Evo100 or let's say good tube 24W will make a trick? I can try and then experiment with the speakers.

no, I'd suggest something like this https://glow-audio.com/products/glow-audio-amp-one-special-edition-single-ended-tube-amplifier

I ran something similar for a while but with some vintage (1973) speakers.

I think with Snell or similar speakers you will get fairly close to what you are after. Just be aware that maximum SPL will be limited and dense rock and pop mixes will sound like you are listening to a transistor radio.