Denon AVR-X6800H now released.

[-Matt-]

Two I read on AVSF:

https://www.avsforum.com/threads/denon-avr-x6800h-owner-anticipation-thread-no-price-talk.3290977/page-3?post_id=63148995&nested_view=1&sortby=oldest#post-63148995

The following so called blank info screen one was solved (setting related):

https://www.avsforum.com/threads/denon-avr-x6800h-owner-anticipation-thread-no-price-talk.3290977/page-3?post_id=63148995&nested_view=1&sortby=oldest#post-63148995

You linked the same one twice. And I also note that we have many of the same users posting in both places, so should avoid double counting.

 

[-Matt-]

Receiving my 6800 this Monday. A bit scary hearing all these issues with the 6800. Is there anyone with the 6800 who has NOT faced these issues?
Edit: oh! I plan to use an LG C3 with this receiver.

Hope it goes well for you, please let us know either way.

 

[peng]

You linked the same one twice. And I also note that we have many of the same users posting in both places, so should avoid double counting.

Thanks, edited. I don't want to count, just to highlight the issues brought up so far.

 

[krumme]

A few questions:

Can I assign same subwoofer sw1 to both a and b speakers?

Can I have two different room correction profiles for a and b ?

Can I assign eg Chromecast to speaker b, and music to speaker a, so I don't have to change speaker when selecting input?

 

[-Matt-]

A few questions:

Can I assign same subwoofer sw1 to both a and b speakers?

Can I have two different room correction profiles for a and b ?

Can I assign eg Chromecast to speaker b, and music to speaker a, so I don't have to change speaker when selecting input?

I've not tried but...

Speaker A B switching only applies to the front L and R, so by default SW1 will be the same in both cases.

For the room correction are you using Audyssey or Dirac? I think for Audyssey if you buy the PC app (MultEQ-X) then you would be able to design separate correction curves on the "reference" and "flat" slots. (EDIT: Audyssey would need separate measurements for the two sets of speakers, I assume it takes these during setup, but I'm actually not sure how Audyssey handles this. Does this effectively give you "Reference A", "Reference B", "Flat A", "Flat B"? This might need a question at askaudyssey or someone who uses the speaker A/B feature to comment). With Dirac I think you get more presets to switch between (4?).

I'm pretty sure you can auto select a source and speaker setup either by using the "speaker preset" feature:

...or possibly you may need to use the "speaker preset" together with the "quick select" feature:

 

[tjcinnamon]

I've not tried but...

Speaker A B switching only applies to the front L and R, so by default SW1 will be the same in both cases.

For the room correction are you using Audyssey or Dirac? I think for Audyssey if you buy the PC app (MultEQ-X) then you would be able to design separate correction curves on the "reference" and "flat" slots. (EDIT: Audyssey would need separate measurements for the two sets of speakers, I assume it takes these during setup, but I'm actually not sure how Audyssey handles this. Does this effectively give you "Reference A", "Reference B", "Flat A", "Flat B"? This might need a question at askaudyssey or someone who uses the speaker A/B feature to comment). With Dirac I think you get more presets to switch between (4?).

I'm pretty sure you can auto select a source and speaker setup either by using the "speaker preset" feature:

View attachment 356295

...or possibly you may need to use the "speaker preset" together with the "quick select" feature:

View attachment 356296

I think Dirac is 3 presets and Audyssey is 2 if you are using both.

To A/B you might be able to use zone 2? Not sure though. I own MQX and Dirac on a Denon 6800.

I A/B room correction suites but haven’t A/B’d speakers via the AVR

 

[-Matt-]

Not definitive but I found this...

https://ask.audyssey.com/hc/en-us/articles/212345203-What-does-Audyssey-do-if-a-speaker-is-off

It implies that audyssey calculates its room correction depending upon which speakers are connected and set as on.

So when you change from speaker A to speaker B it should simply change over to using the correction calculated from the measurements for speaker B.

I.e. A single Audysses EQ should include measurements for all speakers (including both front A and B). (You should confirm that when you run Audyssey it really does take measurements for both sets of front speakers). If you use the app, both speaker A and speaker B should be corrected towards the same target.

(This is my guess based on what is said in the link above).

 

[broncogr]

X6800 Presentation PowerPoint (courtesy of avclub.gr)

https://we.tl/t-0Nou5DZ9mc

Get it while the link is still active

 

[dave999z]

The Denon site lists the depth of the unit as 15.3" with the antenna removed, but it's not clear exactly how they measure that. Could anyone who owns one (and has it in an accessible location) possibly measure from the front of the volume knob to the rear speaker binding posts (I presume that is what sticks out most on the rear panel)? (I can swap the power cord for a lower profile right angle one that basically sticks out about as far as the speaker posts.) If so, I would greatly appreciate it. I'm trying to determine exactly how much internal clearance you'd need to put this inside a cabinet and be able to close the cabinet door (cabinet is vented, and also quite wide, so the unit isn't going to be closed up in there). I think my AV cabinet is right at the border of being able to fit this thing inside.

 

[KenMasters]

The Denon site lists the depth of the unit as 15.3" with the antenna removed...

That measurement is with the antenna, 14.9" is without the antenna, which is about what I get measuring from front dial to back posts.

 

[dave999z]

That measurement is with the antenna, 14.9" is without the antenna, which is about what I get measuring from front dial to back posts.

Great. Thank you very much!

 

[dave999z]

For a 7.2.4 setup, what are the considerations in choosing between the xr-6800h ($3500) versus the xr-4800h ($2500) plus a 2 channel power amp for front L&R (say $1000)?

The 6800 alone saves space (obviously), but the 4800 + a separate power amp would probably perform better driving front L&R towers when listening to 2-channel (processed to 2.2 and room corrected) music content?

Is anything else better about the 6800?

 

[EWL5]

For a 7.2.4 setup, what are the considerations in choosing between the xr-6800h ($3500) versus the xr-4800h ($2500) plus a 2 channel power amp for front L&R (say $1000)?

The 6800 alone saves space (obviously), but the 4800 + a separate power amp would probably perform better driving front L&R towers when listening to 2-channel (processed to 2.2 and room corrected) music content?

Is anything else better about the 6800?

It's got the better ESS Sabre DACs...if that's important...

 

[KenMasters]

Is anything else better about the 6800?

Masimo released a video detailing the improvements:

 

[tmukh]

Received my 6800H a few weeks back but took a while to set it up in the new room. Initial impressions are very positive. I'm not using eARC or even HDMI CEC (disabled in all my devices as I really dislike the "magic" of CEC - will use logitech harmony instead). Facing no issues with the receiver.

Have done some initial calibration with Audyssey as well as Dirac (two target curves - dirac default and my own curve with a steeper high frequency roll off). Audyssey is good as usual but Dirac definitely does a better job in achieving the target curve (as verified by REW). Will post some charts later.

A bummer though is that there is no HDMI port in the front (unlike my 4400H), so have had to permanently attach a long HDMI cable to one of the back AUX HDMI ports for future REW measurements.

One weird problem is that Dirac app on my macbook cannot seem to detect the receiver when they are on different VLANs (I have a ubiquiti unifi setup at home). With a similar network setup, my mobile phone's AV receiver app can detect the 6800H when the phone and receiver are on different VLANs. Need to spend some time troubleshooting this, but if any of you also happen to be a networking nerd and have managed to make the Denon Dirac work with different VLANs, please feel free to share your knowledge.

 

[-Matt-]

One weird problem is that Dirac app on my macbook cannot seem to detect the receiver when they are on different VLANs (I have a ubiquiti unifi setup at home). With a similar network setup, my mobile phone's AV receiver app can detect the 6800H when the phone and receiver are on different VLANs. Need to spend some time troubleshooting this, but if any of you also happen to be a networking nerd and have managed to make the Denon Dirac work with different VLANs, please feel free to share your knowledge.

Not being able to connect across vlans is probably expected behavior. It is more 'magic' that the AV receiver app can do this!

It should be possible to work around this by setting up a firewall rule in your router to pass data from your AV receiver's IP address to your macbook (and vice versa).

 

[tmukh]

Not being able to connect across vlans is probably expected behavior. It is more 'magic' that the AV receiver app can do this!

It should be possible to work around this by setting up a firewall rule in your router to pass data from your AV receiver's IP address to your macbook (and vice versa).

The reason the Denon AV receiver mobile app works in spite of them being on different VLANs is because I've configured multicast DNS (for the discovery portion) in the Unifi settings along with some appropriate firewall rules for the regular app traffic. However, Dirac seems to use SSDP (instead of mDNS) for its broadcast protocol and I could not find a straightforward way to enable relaying those packets across VLANs in UDM. I've created a ticket with Unifi. Let's see but I'm not very hopeful since some others have pointed out that apparently Ubiquiti is still working on this feature for the past year or longer. (Yes, I did try opening up full traffic in the firewall between the laptop and the Denon but it did not help)

For now, looks like I'll need to switch my laptop temporarily to the IOT VLAN each time I need to use Dirac.

Spoiler: Warning - boring networking details about Denon+Dirac implementation

While trying to troubleshoot the above problem, I ran wireshark and learnt a bit on the underlying networking communcations between the Dirac app running on the laptop and the Denon receiver. So here it is:

Step 1:
From Denon, Port 1900
SSDP broadcast: http://<denon IP addr>:36299/Device.xml

Step 2:
From Laptop (Dirac app) to Denon:

Full URI: http://<Denon IP address>:36299/Device.xml
HTTP GET /Device.xml HTTP/1.0

Step 3:
Response XML from Denon to Laptop provides the Dirac app with the necessary information about the important Dirac ports such as the Dirac X_Port which is 33385 and the Dirac Rest API port 8090.

<root
xmlns="urn:schemas-upnp-org:device-1-0"
xmlns:diracns="urn:schemas-dirac-com:diracio:2">
<specVersion>
<major>
1
</major>
<minor>
0
</minor>
</specVersion>
<device>
<deviceType>
urn:schemas-upnp-org:device:MediaRenderer:1
</deviceType>
<friendlyName>
AVR-X6800H
</friendlyName>
<manufacturer>
Denon
</manufacturer>
<modelName>
AVR-X6800H
</modelName>
<UDN>
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx MASKED OUT BY ME xxxxxxxxxxxxx
</UDN>
<diracns:X_port>
33385
</diracns:X_port>
<diracns:X_rest_api>
8090
</diracns:X_rest_api>
<diracns:X_type>
Stimuli;Filtering
</diracns:X_type>
<iconList>
<icon>
<mimetype>
image/svg+xml
</mimetype>
<width>
254
</width>
<height>
254
</height>
<depth>
24
</depth>
<url>
/img/logo.png
</url>
</icon>
</iconList>
</device>
</root>

I did not go further but from here it may be safe to assume the laptop app will start communicating with the Dirac service on the Denon using the above ports.

If you have a home network (non Ubiquiti) that does allow SSDP broadcast across VLans, then perhaps these port numbers could come in useful to fine tune the firewall rules.

Also, though this is not Dirac, I noticed another important UDP broadcast by the denon for broadcasting its general AIOS service at the following location:
http://<denon IP address>:60006/upnp/desc/aios_device/aios_device.xml
This seems to return a much more detailed Xml about the Denon receiver and its capabilities.

 

[Joaquinín]

Here are the low level input/output specifications of this unit according to the manual:

Analog
Input sensitivity: 200 mV
Frequency response: 10 Hz – 100 kHz — +1, –3 dB (Direct mode)
S/N: 102 dB (IHF–A weighted, Direct mode)
Distortion: 0.005 % (20 Hz – 20 kHz) (Direct mode)
Rated output: 1.2 V

Digital
D/A output: Rated output — 2 V (at 0 dB playback)
Total harmonic distortion — 0.004 % (1 kHz, at 0 dB)
S/N ratio — 104 dB
Dynamic range — 104 dB
Digital input: Format — Digital audio interface

Phono equalizer
Input sensitivity: 2.5 mV
RIAA deviation: ±1 dB (20 Hz to 20 kHz)
S/N: 74 dB (IHF-A)
Distortion factor: 0.03 % (1 kHz, 3 V)

Isn't it dissapointing? (THD at 1khz doesn't even reach -88dBs).

 

[peng]

Here are the low level input/output specifications of this unit according to the manual:

Analog
Input sensitivity: 200 mV
Frequency response: 10 Hz – 100 kHz — +1, –3 dB (Direct mode)
S/N: 102 dB (IHF–A weighted, Direct mode)
Distortion: 0.005 % (20 Hz – 20 kHz) (Direct mode)
Rated output: 1.2 V

Digital
D/A output: Rated output — 2 V (at 0 dB playback)
Total harmonic distortion — 0.004 % (1 kHz, at 0 dB)
S/N ratio — 104 dB
Dynamic range — 104 dB
Digital input: Format — Digital audio interface

Phono equalizer
Input sensitivity: 2.5 mV
RIAA deviation: ±1 dB (20 Hz to 20 kHz)
S/N: 74 dB (IHF-A)
Distortion factor: 0.03 % (1 kHz, 3 V)

Isn't it dissapointing? (THD at 1khz doesn't even reach -88dBs).

For 2X the price, the AV10 spec doesn't reach 94 dB, so take your pick. Keep in mind that's specs, on the bench it may reach well over 100 dB.

According to Masimo, the Cinema 30 has identical THD specs specs at 1 kHz, but measured 107 dB, same as the AV10 and a touch better than the AVM90.

 

[Newman]

Denon X6800H 4-sub question

Hi, I am looking for some advice from the Denon-competent. I have a particular speaker setup in mind, and not sure if the X6800H could handle it (and if not, what would be able to do it).

I want to run a 4-sub setup, where 2 of the subs are actually the (active-amplified, powerful, capable) bass drivers of the FL and FR speakers (consider these drivers to be fully competent for subwoofer duties). The other two subs are normal, standalone subs. I am trying to wrap my head around the best way to do this with a modern .4 AV unit and their bass EQ abilities. NOTE that they will most likely XO at 120 Hz to the higher-frequency drivers of the FL and FR speakers, whereas the other 2 subs will XO at 80 Hz.

[Option 1] If I simply run the FL and FR as ‘full range’, and only utilise 2 of the four .4 outputs on the AVR, does that then limit what I can do with the ‘four’ subwoofers? Do I still get LFE to all 4 subs? Can the X6800H do LFE distribution? With this setup, I suppose that the sub-bass frequencies in the FL and FR program content will no longer be distributed to 4 subs, in which case, the benefits of having 4 subs will not apply to all the bass content in the FL and FR program content? That seems a bit less than ideal to me, don’t you agree?

[Option 2] Alternatively, I could utilise all four of the .4 outputs, by powering the FL and FR active bass drivers from two of the AVR’s subwoofer outputs, and designate their crossover point at 120 Hz. Do you see any big problems with this idea? Does it actually provide any benefits in terms of subwoofer benefits, or flexibility, or utilisation with Audy or Dirac? The only real negative that I thought of, is that I am stuck with the standard AVR crossover slopes at the (120 Hz) XO to subwoofer, whereas using them as a full-range speaker allows me to apply a digital XO and slope of my choice to the next drive unit.

Can the X6800H handle both of the above alternatives? Any limitations that would apply? If so, are there any other AVP/AVR units (excluding Storm/Trinnov-like budgets) that could do it better?

What if I try to implement a Multi Sub Optimiser setup? Is one of the above configurations better for this? Is the X6800H suitable?

thanks