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Denon AVR-X6800H now released.
- Thread starter -Matt-
- Start date
Sound like software glitch that will be fixed via updates, quicker if you guys let Denon and Marantz know about it. I suggest people make such complains to both D and M, just to double the pressure.
nice video and a surprising amount of useful tech info, thank you for sharing. One thing seems a bit off:
- DACs = 2x ES9017 = 16 channels
- Preouts = 13.4 = 17 channels
P.S.
And the ES9017 is still the cheapest and 'worst' multichannel DAC built by ESS. Still hoping they'll go back to AKM but the chances look veeery slim.
In another YT video, it was explained that it uses a PCM5102A for one of the subout, I forgot if it was the sub out 1, or 4.
The ES9017 is not the cheapest and definitely the worst 8 ch model built by ESS.
For example, Yamaha has been using the ES9006, or 9007 that use later on, but it looks like the same, just a special number for Yamaha for some reason.
https://www.esstech.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/SABRE9006A-Datasheet-v1.3.pdf Yamaha does use the better ES9026Pro for their higher end AVRs/AVPs though.
While it is true that the ES9017 is relatively cheap, it has very decent specs, and that makes the 107 dB SINAD claimed by Masimo believable.
That sounds about right. Would be good to know which one.
I wonder if it really is more 'economical' to use such funny tricks instead of just a single board with three 8x DACs or five 4x.
According to the ESS website, it is the 'worst' multichannel as of 2024.
The only lower level is the strange SABRE9006A which seems out of place in that list. Even the 9010 is not made anymore, probably the reason why we got an 'upgrade'.
Not saying that es9017 is bad or not enough. But saving pennies with the cheapest DAC on a $4500 high-end device is not exactly expected. And I still want AKMs
P.S.
btw, is there any info on the ADC chips? Those used to be low level cheapos too.
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The 6800 is USD $3,500 no? (Still quite expensive.)
If you're upset about that, you don't want to know what Mercedes and BMW are doing to save a buck!Not saying that es9017 is bad or not enough. But saving pennies with the cheapest DAC on a $4500 high-end device is not exactly expected. And I still want AKMs
They really don't build them like they used to!
Yeah, as soon as you send your $3500 Denon 6800 to Amir, we should be good to go!
Why is it out of place? Yamaha's RX-A4A, and the A6A (except the main channels) are still using it, just with a different number, i'e. 9007S.
Agreed, they are saving pennies, wish they would use at least the ES9026Pro, or the even the 9010K2M if they prefer 2 channel chips, or as you said go back to AKM's. On the other hand, practically speaking they might be right, in saving even just pennies if they feel not saving those pennies wouldn't do anything for them other than bragging rights.Not saying that es9017 is bad or not enough. But saving pennies with the cheapest DAC on a $4500 high-end device is not exactly expected. And I still want AKMs
They might have used a slightly better one, based on something Gene said in one of those YT review videos but I might have remember wrong, will try and see if I could find it.
Sure, but I have to say in many cases they are doing better, such as the use of better DAC chips (and the volume control chips), even the ES9017 is better than the PCM1791 they have had used for years, until may be about 8-9 years ago, except in their flagship models, that they always used better ones such as the PCM1972, PCM1795 or 1976. For PS, yes I feel the old ones are better, considering those old models have only 7 mouths to feed.
my bad, I was thinking about the $4500 Marantz Cinema 30. Same chips.
unfortunatelly I do know that too
true that.
Those TOTL AVRs used to cost ~$1500 for many years. More solid, full metal builds and there was a new & improved generation almost every year for almost no extra money.
During the last ~5 years the price tripled and the main reason seems to be "because we can".
The SABRE9006A misses specs & features that all others have (e.g. hyperstream), its DNR/THD specs are 5-10db below all others and even the naming is different (everything else is named ES90xx). Seems to be a (much) older generation. But you are right, that one is probably the real cheapo in the 2024 lineup. Guess we are lucky they did not use it
May be. But I still think there is something about that "velvet" stuff, at least the measurements look better. Or it's just a case of AKM nostalgia.
I also remember something about a (minimally) upgraded ADC. Some slidedeck from the launchtime of the current gen .. or maybe it was an AV10 teardown.
But haven't seen anything related to the 2024 models, maybe you/someone did...
I thought (again, not really sure as it was distant memory) it was Gene, in an video, commented that he noticed down sampling to 192 kHz. The models prior to 2022/23, including the flagship AV8805/AVR/C-8500H would have down sampled to 96 kHz due to the cheapest ADC chip D+M used. So, if my memory is not too bad, then they must have used a better ADC, that could do up to 192 kHz.
You seem to be the only one aside from me who seem to care about the ADC lol.... For me, the reason is, I started trying using DLBC (PC version) with Audyssey FL/R bypass so I could have DEQ on, first impression is, I like what I heard, but have not REW anything yet. In such configuration, I would feel better if the new D+M does use better ADC to minimize chance of signal degradation due to the double conversion. In my HT setup I have no such worry because Anthem did upgrade their ADC to one of the best current available. That was a nice surprise, but I think they did it because they somehow choose not to provide the analog bypass feature for their AVRs so they offered some sort of a consolation price, just my guess...
If I managed to find that video, or info about the ADC currently used I will report back.
ADC used in the previous gen:
Those AVRs still have a phono stage and multiple analog inputs. The low quality ADC is still used/needed and quite a sore.
Although that AKM chip you linked looks better than what I remember (some even lower/older PCM with specs in the 80-90dB range.)
Yes, people who wants to use Audyssey, and/or other dsp functions with analog inputs will need the adc, otherwise the can use direct mode to bypass it.
