Schiit Vidar 2 Stereo Amplifier Review

[Blumlein 88]

B&O first released their ClassD in the Beolab1 circa 1997, and released their first ICE modules in 2001 as the A series the ICEpower ASP series came out in 2003...

So we do have a track record for modules of well over 20 years... and heading towards 30 years now.

Sony had a ClassD amp out in 1978... (TA-N88)

It didn't hit the audio mainstream until the Tripath chips hit the market in 1996...

So in audio, ClassD is primarily of this millenium/century ... but we are a quarter of the way through this century now!

Yes, I have a Tripath amp still works perfectly more than 20 years after it was made. My Ice power amp going on 14 years and still good.

 

[JSmith]

Why is that?

Could be many different reasons... many TV's for example have 12 months manufacturer warranty, so I don't think that is indicative of build quality or longevity.


JSmith

 

[Blumlein 88]

Could be many different reasons... many TV's for example have 12 months manufacturer warranty, so I don't think that is indicative of build quality or longevity.


JSmith

I remember when there was something of a warranty war with cars in early 1980's. Warranties on those weren't all that much, but started to move up. 36k/36 months or even 50k/60 months. Early Toyotas and the very early years of Honda they had 12k/12 months. Especially with Honda being a new automobile company you might have expected more. However both companies had quickly earned a rep for having bullet proof products or nearly so. The warranty wasn't a big concern, and in fact the long warranties by more established brands were needed because people knew they were more likely to need them. So it was necessary for them almost.

I'd certainly like a long warranty all other things being equal, but they rarely are. With electronics and the majority suffering early death or lasting a long time a modest warranty is probably going to cover things well enough.

 

[Count Dacula]

My experience has been.... 1990's = ADCOM, 2000's = Parasound, 2010's = Schiit, 2020's = Nord (NC252)

I wonder how my Vidar 1 compares to the old ADCOM 545 II? I'm pretty sure power-wise, the others are all very close.

I still love the ADCOM when it's hooked up. Today, I found the Vidar to be pretty smooth and mellow on some older B&W I'm trying to get used to, usually a KEF guy. The thing is, the Vidar shuts down pretty friggin easy. I would rock the ADCOM at parties with the yellow distortion lights steady...and it would still be cranking with dynamics. The best part is it NEVER shut down. I dunno how I would deal with it in a live situation, but for sure the Vidar shuts TF down.

But, nfw I would pay $800 for the Vidar 2. My Vidar 1 was much less expensive. I did some inflation calculation on the old school 2 channel receivers we love. Every one I look at ended up being $1500 in 2024 dollars. The funny thing is, when I took the cheap new $200 2024 Yamaha that has a nice 100w AB and ran the numbers in reverse, that receiver would be $55 in 1980. So by the metric of how MUCH MUCH better cost/performance we get now a days, it really makes that Vidar 2 look like a terrible deal.

I have a big room for testing swapping and matching systems now. It's a thing that was totally lacking for me in the past. I have all my old amps and speakers cycling now. All I know is the Parasound is going onto PA speakers. It has the most power and the worst sound, lol.

 

[Endibol]

After reading this thread, I am really curious to listen to those new class D amplifier. All class D amps that I experienced until now sound sterile and unpleasant. For the moment I am still loyal to class A/B.

All amplifiers that are transparant (in-audible harmonics, flat frequency response) should sound exactly the same, independent of class.
If you hear a difference between two of them, then at least one of them either has an audible harmonics signature or has a non-linear frequency response (the latter usually doesn't play a role with modern amplifiers).

So I think the sterile sound signature of class D you heard, is caused by the fact that you were used to listen to class A/B amps with a relatively high number of audible harmonics. In other words you compared a transparant amplifier with a non-transparant one.

 

[youdontmakesense]

All amplifiers that are transparant (in-audible harmonics, flat frequency response) should sound exactly the same, independent of class.
If you hear a difference between two of them, then at least one of them either has an audible harmonics signature or has a non-linear frequency response (the latter usually doesn't play a role with modern amplifiers).

So I think the sterile sound signature of class D you heard, is caused by the fact that you were used to listen to class A/B amps with a relatively high number of audible harmonics. In other words you compared a transparant amplifier with a non-transparant one.

Sounds like the kool-aid talking...

 

[Kegemusha]

Maybe that most of the high-performing class D modules have only been around for ~5 years?

I have my Ncore NC122 now for little more than 3 years. I have emotiva class AB and I had one of the 1st Peachtree class AB as well, none of them lasted more than 4 years.
I still use the emotiva amp for TV sound, one channel has some noise that was annoying in desktop setup. So my experience in class AB quality is not the best

 

[somebodyelse]

Crown had their Drivecore chipset operational around 20 years ago?

The kept it in house though and it appears only on Harman products (Crown, JBL, Lexicon, etc...)

I was sticking to something that undeniably met the 'high performance' part of the claim. Some of the earlier ones may clear that bar too, depending on how much lower it is. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-class-d-start-to-not-suck.36650/post-1287697 suggests the Sony may have cleared it in 1976.

 

[wyup]

Mains noise was variable depending on how I grounded it.

I'm interested about what you mean about grounding the amplifier: How does grounding of a domestic electrical installation affect audio gear? How do you improve grounding without a safety ground derivation?
May I improve it with a external EMI/RFI filter? Is it related to ground loops?

Hoping you find this relevant, thanks for the review.

 

[Count Dacula]

I ran the numbers on our $800 amp, it would be $330 in 1990.

I think my ADCOM was about $400 back then. So, in effect, Schiit has lived up to their name, delivering a similar level of product from 35 years ago, but for more money....the opposite of the rest of the industry. Can I get a 13" B&W VHF TV over here for $1000?

 

[dasdoing]

30 seconds on a cold start,
60 seconds from stand-by?

have they switched this up?

 

[Sokel]

30 seconds on a cold start,
60 seconds from stand-by?

have they switched this up?

Wow,didn't notice the 60 sec thing.
Stand by is useless this way then,better cold start it from the beginning.

 

[Trudius]

Class AB has been around much longer than 50 years. Should we wait 50 years before we trust class D or Hypex? A rhetorical question needing no answer.

That would be ~38 years from now, at which point class D might have passed class A/B in in terms of reliability. But that is not of any use for someone making a purchase in 2024. There are ways to stress test products that does not involve asking customers on a forum with the passage of time. That would be another use for the ASR methodologies IMO.

 

[amirm]

I'm interested about what you mean about grounding the amplifier: How does grounding of a domestic electrical installation affect audio gear? How do you improve grounding without a safety ground derivation?

I make no changes to safety ground. The grounding I am talking about is relative to the interconnect and device/analyzer.

By default, Audio Precision analyzer unbalanced inputs are floating, i.e. not referenced to chassis ground. Your audio gear unless double insulated, is not so. The RCA shield is connected to chassis ground. This is what causes ground loops. With AP, I am able to experiment to see what scenario minimizes this. I can ground the chassis, ground at one end of RCA or the other end. On some devices it makes little difference. On others, any grounding makes it much worse. These are the vagaries introduced in using unbalanced audio interconnection.

 

[Great Sun Jester]

I make no changes to safety ground. The grounding I am talking about is relative to the interconnect and device/analyzer.

By default, Audio Precision analyzer unbalanced inputs are floating, i.e. not referenced to chassis ground. Your audio gear unless double insulated, is not so. The RCA shield is connected to chassis ground. This is what causes ground loops. With AP, I am able to experiment to see what scenario minimizes this. I can ground the chassis, ground at one end of RCA or the other end. On some devices it makes little difference. On others, any grounding makes it much worse. These are the vagaries introduced in using unbalanced audio interconnection.

Nothing like cable or satellite TV F connectors

 

[musicforcities]

For what does it use the 1-2W, if you still have to switch it on manually? What happened to the idea of just switching off?

I voted fine due to competition in the price and power range from hypex and even purifi. And even recent chip amps at op to half the and reasonable power (eg, fossi v3 mono)

But part of me thinks it deserves a great due to in house engineering, USA construction and a very nice case and circuit layout. There is a lot to like here.

I wonder what Schiit could do if they went the Heresy route for speaker amps they way they did with the headphone amp. Plenty of room in that case for a dual mono class d with loads of power. Even if they kept a linear power supply. If they bit the bullet a got some purifi tech in there they could be there with the NAD masters and benchmark amps in terms of performance. I doubt they would however due to pricing and a desire to engineer stuff in house.

However, the standby button seems missed opportunity to add some basic functionality. Without a 12v trigger or a sensing circuit that turns the amp on automatically when line level signal is detected, there is not that much useful about it. How much more expensive can a 3.5mm jack be once you add the hardware (relay, power supply, button etc) for a standby circuit? Pennies. Maybe it has some soft start functionality? It it cheaper than a long rod that would run down the chassis to actuate an actual power switch at the back? I assume they wanted to keep line voltages contained to the back for construction costs/saftey certifications and maybe for noise reasons? That’s fine…but these days having a standby without having a trigger or sense circuit at this price seems sort of bizarre.

 

[vlad335]

I just bought my first piece of Schiit, a Jotunheim amp and I really like this thing. It powers my HE-6se's with ease and sounds great. Every amp I tried couldnt drive these, at all! These headphones are now awesome and the best I own.

Only thing I don't like about it is the power button in the back.

Definitely intrigued by this company. Now scoping on one of their balanced DAC's. I'm actually using a Qudelix Q5 into the Schiit. I am thinking this could be better.. A lot better which is hard to believe.

 

[Count Dacula]

What makes you state that Hypex or Purifi products won't last, basically implying they are unreliable? Any sources or data to back that up? ANY? Please state them. I'm genuinely curious.
Besides my beloved AB amps, I now use both Hypex and Purifi amps because of their clean and efficient power, and yes: reliability. Am I that wrong?
You won't be recapping your Purifi or Hypex modules in 30 years, because you will just not have to

It's funny. In automotive, there's a bunch of different methods to ascertain an ideal oil change interval or other wear-related service. The best or most reliable metric is going by how much fuel was consumed or how many hours of operation (stationary engines). Applying the same principle in a creative way would be to say the gobs of power consumed through an AB amp might tend to stress the components to failure in a linear way, compared to a D class.

I know it's a gross and inapplicable way to look at it, but I bet there's a discoverable mean-time-to-failure ratio verses power consumption, or efficiency or however you want to state that part.

I dunno, my H&SS background thrives on rules, formulas and pattern recognition across disciplines. No big deal, but I have confidence in an efficient chip that consumes less juice. Look at how that works out for integrated circuits....more power isn't better in terms of service life.

 

[wwenze]

It's funny. In automotive, there's a bunch of different methods to ascertain an ideal oil change interval or other wear-related service. The best or most reliable metric is going by how much fuel was consumed or how many hours of operation (stationary engines). Applying the same principle in a creative way would be to say the gobs of power consumed through an AB amp might tend to stress the components to failure in a linear way, compared to a D class.

I know it's a gross and inapplicable way to look at it, but I bet there's a discoverable mean-time-to-failure ratio verses power consumption, or efficiency or however you want to state that part.

I dunno, my H&SS background thrives on rules, formulas and pattern recognition across disciplines. No big deal, but I have confidence in an efficient chip that consumes less juice. Look at how that works out for integrated circuits....more power isn't better in terms of service life.

Only if ceteris paribus

However this is the electronics industry we're talking about. You can't even buy two power supplies of the same model without them being different some way or another.

Or to put the message across clearly, there is no correlation between different design topologies. The only correlation is how prone-to-breaking the designer designed the product. And power supply adapters? It's free real estate.

 

[pogo]

If you hear a difference between two of them, then at least one of them either has an audible harmonics signature or has a non-linear frequency response (the latter usually doesn't play a role with modern amplifiers).

You can't say that across the board, see also here: Link