Spotify to launch 'Hi-Fi' CD Quality Tier.

[bodhi]

The difficulty of finding successfully documented tests could perhaps be a clue in itself. Even hearing the difference between 128kbps MP3 and lossless is very difficult on most tracks. 384kbps OGG Vorbis is way better.

This is the elephant in the living room. It's strange, even most objectivists go with 128 or even 192 being horrible to listen.

At some point I remember feeling pretty sad when I could just barely hear difference in 128 and that was trying hard with big genelecs or headphones. And not with all tracks.

And all these other people hear night and day difference with potato as a speaker?

 

[KosherButcher]

No I have the normalization off in both cases . Anyway …

Simply having normalization turned off doesn’t necessarily mean the levels between the two streaming services will be perfectly loundness matched. And even a fraction of a difference in level will trick the ear. I’m sure there are ways to properly set up a better blind test, but it would require more than just disabling normalization.

 

[sigbergaudio]

As shared earlier in the thread: https://abx.digitalfeed.net/

 

[Hayabusa]

Simply having normalization turned off doesn’t necessarily mean the levels between the two streaming services will be perfectly loundness matched. And even a fraction of a difference in level will trick the ear. I’m sure there are ways to properly set up a better blind test, but it would require more than just disabling normalization.

I once ripped a spotify track and did subtract the samples with a CD copy I had,
The result was a difference file at a very low amplitude with only some high frequency 'hiss' in it.
It should at least tell us that disabling normalization brings you close to the original redbook cd track.

 

[KosherButcher]

As shared earlier in the thread: https://abx.digitalfeed.net/

This

 

[Pearljam5000]

As shared earlier in the thread: https://abx.digitalfeed.net/

Who said this test is reliable ?
What do we know about the files used in it ?

 

[sigbergaudio]

Who said this test is reliable ?
What do we know about the files used in it ?

You can also create your own test with Foobar.

Download foobar2000

foobar2000

www.foobar2000.org

foobar2000: Components Repository - ABX Comparator

foobar2000

www.foobar2000.org

 

[Timcognito]

The key to comparing formats is a clean hi-res master of well recorded track. Try this, no MP3 though.

Compare Formats - Free Downloads

Award-winning audiophile high-resolution studio masters; depth placement exceptional sound stage. A music download shop supporting audio files in 768kHz, 352kHz (DXD), 192kHz and 96kHz. Also FLAC and DSD format is supported. Five star rating reviews. Free hi-res download samples in all formats...

soundliaison.com

 

[KosherButcher]

You can also create your own test with Foobar.

Download foobar2000

foobar2000

www.foobar2000.org

foobar2000: Components Repository - ABX Comparator

foobar2000

www.foobar2000.org

Or with this:

ABX & audio blind tests · FunkyABX

funkyabx.gearpix.app

 

[goat76]

As shared earlier in the thread: https://abx.digitalfeed.net/

ABX tests don't work very well for me, I easily get disturbed by the constant restarts of the song.

I have done A/B-tests where I put the two sound files parallel on two different tracks in my DAW, and then I mute one of the tracks, and while I shut my eyes I fast-click on the solo button on the same track until I have no clue if it's activated or not. After that, I keep my eyes shut and while playing the song I can shift between the two tracks without any disturbing restarts. This helps me concentrate completely on just audible differences if there are any, and when I feel ready to confirm my choice I take a look if it is the track I think it is. I repeat this process until I have done it enough times to be certain I can or can't hear the difference between the files.

 

[Zensō]

ABX tests don't work very well for me, I easily get disturbed by the constant restarts of the song.

I have done A/B-tests where I put the two sound files parallel on two different tracks in my DAW, and then I mute one of the tracks, and while I shut my eyes I fast-click on the solo button on the same track until I have no clue if it's activated or not. After that, I keep my eyes shut and while playing the song I can shift between the two tracks without any disturbing restarts. This helps me concentrate completely on just audible differences if there are any, and when I feel ready to confirm my choice I take a look if it is the track I think it is. I repeat this process until I have done it enough times to be certain I can or can't hear the difference between the files.

What did you learn?

 

[sigbergaudio]

ABX tests don't work very well for me, I easily get disturbed by the constant restarts of the song.

I have done A/B-tests where I put the two sound files parallel on two different tracks in my DAW, and then I mute one of the tracks, and while I shut my eyes I fast-click on the solo button on the same track until I have no clue if it's activated or not. After that, I keep my eyes shut and while playing the song I can shift between the two tracks without any disturbing restarts. This helps me concentrate completely on just audible differences if there are any, and when I feel ready to confirm my choice I take a look if it is the track I think it is. I repeat this process until I have done it enough times to be certain I can or can't hear the difference between the files.

The link I shared in the post you quoted lets you switch while the song is playing, without restarts.

 

[KosherButcher]

ABX tests don't work very well for me, I easily get disturbed by the constant restarts of the song.

I have done A/B-tests where I put the two sound files parallel on two different tracks in my DAW, and then I mute one of the tracks, and while I shut my eyes I fast-click on the solo button on the same track until I have no clue if it's activated or not. After that, I keep my eyes shut and while playing the song I can shift between the two tracks without any disturbing restarts. This helps me concentrate completely on just audible differences if there are any, and when I feel ready to confirm my choice I take a look if it is the track I think it is. I repeat this process until I have done it enough times to be certain I can or can't hear the difference between the files.

The Funky ABX test that I posted also allows you to not only switch without restarting the song, but to use clips from any part of the not. In addition, you can set it to automatically switch on its own, without your having you click anything. The website is designed exactly for these purposes.

 

[goat76]

What did you learn?

I have never done this for comparison between lossy and lossless files, I used this method to test if I could hear any differences with upsampling, which I could. With upsampling, I could hear a more airy presentation which helped to reveal reverb tails in a more natural way.
I don't think I would hear the relatively small differences with upsampling if I didn't have the chance to seamlessly change between the two audio files without any interruptions.

If I get the urge to test lossy vs lossless, I will definitely use this method instead of an ABX test. But in this time and age, I no longer see a point in testing this as I see lossy formats as a thing of the past when there could be a bandwidth problem.

 

[Tell]

ABX tests don't work very well for me, I easily get disturbed by the constant restarts of the song.

I have done A/B-tests where I put the two sound files parallel on two different tracks in my DAW, and then I mute one of the tracks, and while I shut my eyes I fast-click on the solo button on the same track until I have no clue if it's activated or not. After that, I keep my eyes shut and while playing the song I can shift between the two tracks without any disturbing restarts. This helps me concentrate completely on just audible differences if there are any, and when I feel ready to confirm my choice I take a look if it is the track I think it is. I repeat this process until I have done it enough times to be certain I can or can't hear the difference between the files.

Yeah I've done it a similar way when testing music for different reasons. I've even gone so far that I take maybe one, two or four bars looping them to completely rule out all the small and big changes that always happens during the track.

 

[goat76]

The link I shared in the post you quoted lets you switch while the song is playing, without restarts.

That's better than similar ABX tests I’ve done in the past, I didn't click on your link as I have no interest in comparing lossy vs lossless files.

 

[KosherButcher]

That's better than similar ABX tests I’ve done in the past, I didn't click on your link as I have no interest in comparing lossy vs lossless files.

The link I posted is for creating your own blind AB tests, with whatever you want. I use it all the time for comparing mixing and mastering versions for clients.

 

[goat76]

The link I posted is for creating your own blind AB tests, with whatever you want. I use it all the time for comparing mixing and mastering versions for clients.

Thank you, I will check it out if I feel the need for something like that.

 

[ads_cft222]

In any case and as a principle hi fi is about preserving information in an intact way. Audibility is debatable , and when its effects exist people give various degrees of importance to them . So in essence there is no reason today for someone to stream lossy files unless he/she uses Bluetooth devices or has bandwidth issues

 

[Emlin]

In any case and as a principle hi fi is about preserving information in an intact way. Audibility is debatable , and when its effects exist people give various degrees of importance to them . So in essence there is no reason today for someone to stream compressed files unless he/she uses Bluetooth devices or has bandwidth issues

In practice, all streamed files music will be compressed. Losslessly or lossily, there's the difference.