Measurements of Sonore microRendu Streamer

[Deleted member 65]

Hello,

In previous posts I saw price being brought up on several occasions that folks would never consider spending $700 on the mRendu but I couldn't help but wonder how much was spent on the bog standard laptop or MAC Mini that they may be using instead? I'm not familiar with many laptops or MAC's of any flavor worth their salt that costs only $700 or less.

The mRendu as tested in DLNA or MPD Mode is in fact a full fledged music server capable of processing all bit rates up to at least DSD64 with no need for other software to do so (except a remote App).

I get that the primary focus of this thread was to investigate the claims of lower noise..etc but I must raise a BS flag when folks bring price into the equation or argument. Frankly in my opinion the mRendu is a bargain when you look at it from a monies standpoint.

cjf,

and where's the music going into the microrendu coming from?

 

[cjf]

cjf,

and where's the music going into the microrendu coming from?

My guess in most cases the music would be living on a NAS somewhere on the local network. In MPD Mode one could simply download the M-Pad or M-Pod App from the iTunes Store for Free to control the MPD Server Mode running within the mRendu

 

[Thomas savage]

Hello,

In previous posts I saw price being brought up on several occasions that folks would never consider spending $700 on the mRendu but I couldn't help but wonder how much was spent on the bog standard laptop or MAC Mini that they may be using instead? I'm not familiar with many laptops or MAC's of any flavor worth their salt that costs only $700 or less.

The mRendu as tested in DLNA or MPD Mode is in fact a full fledged music server capable of processing all bit rates up to at least DSD64 with no need for other software to do so (except a remote App).

I get that the primary focus of this thread was to investigate the claims of lower noise..etc but I must raise a BS flag when folks bring price into the equation or argument. Frankly in my opinion the mRendu is a bargain when you look at it from a monies standpoint.

Well if you already own a laptop or what ever then spending $700 on the idea the mRendu will lower 'noise' and thusly improve fidelity is rather wasteful, at least going on its measured performance here.

If like me you don't own a laptop or indeed anything that plugs into you dac then it might be worth considering. For it's functionality as you point out.


That's what I take from this thread and as a member of this forums management ( just me and amir) if that's what I think then this forum can't really be accused of any ill will towards mRendu.

It's like a garage saying ' if you buy our RS racing clutch( the measured performance of which is in line with your own clutch) your car will be faster' now if you need a new clutch then all well and good but don't go replacing a perfectly good one thinking you will have a faster car... You won't.

Again the fuss this simple message has caused, the bitterness and pages of passive aggression not to mention poorly disguised person attacks towards amir ( and some very obvious ones too!) is shocking.

 

[cjf]

Again the fuss this simple message has caused, the bitterness and pages of passive aggression not to mention poorly disguised person attacks towards amir ( and some very obvious ones too!) is shocking.

I hear ya... Now if you two want suggestions for the next bloody battle topic my vote would be to have Amrim break out his LCR Meter and start probing around the USB,Speaker Cable and Power Cable markets to see what kind of ghosts can be stirred up there

 

[Thomas savage]

I hear ya... Now if you two want suggestions for the next bloody battle topic my vote would be to have Amrim break out his LCR Meter and start probing around the USB,Speaker Cable and Power Cable markets to see what kind of ghosts can be stirred up there

Don't encourage him all those years in corporate management seems to of fostered secret desirers of rebellion now freely unleashed in retirement

 

[Sal1950]

In previous posts I saw price being brought up on several occasions that folks would never consider spending $700 on the mRendu but I couldn't help but wonder how much was spent on the bog standard laptop or MAC Mini that they may be using instead? I'm not familiar with many laptops or MAC's of any flavor worth their salt that costs only $700 or less.

The laptop is a multi purpose device, you'd have to divide its numerous other functions besides being a server into it's cost. The PC I use was built long before I got into Computer Audio and still is very functional doing it's original intended chores so the cost today as a music server is zero. OS = Linux $0. Manag Software = Open Source $0.
I don't know of any option that comes with a built in Music Library.

 

[amirm]

I don't see how this device can be used as a music server. It is an accessory to one as Michael explained. You must still have a computer as your music server with it. What it allows you to do is to put your DAC far away from your music server and talk to it using DLNA, Roon, etc.

As for the price, it is just too expensive as a network renderer. Sonore's own sonicorbiter se does the same thing at half the price: http://www.sonicorbiter.sonore.us/

My comment was that if they were going to double the price to bring extra fidelity, they they should deliver it and include such things as galvanic isolation as to not create the iFi situation if indeed lack of isolation is the problem.

Even cheaper is to use a Raspberry Pi to do the same thing with appropriate software. Here is one example: http://www.rpimusicplayer.com/. You can buy the hardware for $35 or something like that.

But really, if the price doesn't bother you, by all means stay with microRendu. There is nothing in this thread against doing that.

 

[amirm]

My guess in most cases the music would be living on a NAS somewhere on the local network. In MPD Mode one could simply download the M-Pad or M-Pod App from the iTunes Store for Free to control the MPD Server Mode running within the mRendu

If you are happy with such an interface, then sure. I like to have very rich functionality in my server, ability to perform room and format conversion, etc. You can't do that on NAS but if it meets your requirement, then sure.

 

[amirm]

OK, some more data .

For the avid readers of this thread, you know that I have shown the fault where new distortions are created to the the combination of microRendu and iFi iPower power supply. I attempted to isolate the issue by using a linear power supply and the problem went away. I thought I do the reverse test which is to keep iFi iPower but do away with the microRendu and see if the performance of iFi iDAC2 is impacted still. This has become important as iFi is pointing the finger at the measurement system being the problem and not a system issue.

So here is the new test setup. The first test was my "control" as before, using the iFi iDAC:

For the second test, I inserted the Uptone Regen into the picture. This allowed me to use the iFi iPower as the power supply for Regen and hence the DAC:

This is the outcome:

We see that the two measurements almost perfectly land on top of each other. The only difference is that we now have addition of a couple of spikes at 8 and 16 Khz. We know from testing of Regen last year that it is at fault (again with combination of external power supply) for inserting these USB related distortion products. So we can ignore that for this situation. After doing so, we see that iFi iPower has NOT contributed to degradation of the iDAC2 as it did when it was paired with microRendu!

Putting two and two together, the only time we seem to have this kind of problem:

is when we pair microRendu and iPower power supply together. With other combinations this problem does not exist in my testing.

Importantly this busts the latests theory that the above observed problem is due to ground loop errors. In these latest tests we have the same identical measurement system of my laptop and Audio Precision analyzer, and iPower power supply and the DAC, yet no mains related distortion problems.

In summary, as I have been saying, iFi and Sonore need to get together and resolve whatever problem the pairing of their two products, the iPower and microRendu, are having. It is not a phantom problem. It gets created only when these two products are put together. Independent testing of iFi iPower as iFi has been doing is useless in figuring this out.

As always, I am open to feedback, corrections, new data, etc. from manufacturers. I hope they use this opportunity to improve their products for their customers. The opportunity is in front of them.

 

[Thomas savage]

Well Ifi have done there tests here, though they are testing the power supply I believe and not in combination with the microrendu. I could be wrong, been a long day.

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f...art-4-uploaded-and-complete-28982/#post557736

 

[amirm]

Well Ifi have done there tests here, though they are testing the power supply I believe and not in combination with the microrendu. I could be wrong, been a long day.

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f...art-4-uploaded-and-complete-28982/#post557736

No, that is what they have been wasting their time doing. Not only are they just testing their power supply alone, but also doing so with an isolation transformer in front of it which no one uses. And picking the best case situation no less. After all that, some of the distortions they show actually match mine (see the ones around 1.5 KHz).

Clearly they are not motivated to help with the situation at hand.

 

[cjf]

OK, some more data .

Honestly I can't say I'm suprised that the Regen/iFi/iFi DAC test resulted in similar results as the iFI DAC/Laptop by itself since the Regen is ecessentially a dumb black box with no real computer parts inside so I would hope that it measures the way it did.

No matter what the mRendu claims in terms of lower noise..etc it's still a computer with a CPU/RAM...etc that also has a hard link tied to the Ethernet network all of which are less than clean. The Ethernet related noise can be addressed with the Black Box Opto Isolator I linked to previously.

I would still love to see a test using the mRendu in the same fashion that most of the world will be using it in (i.e..NAA Mode). In that mode it's been said the computer related activity is minimized which in turn should lower the load on the power supply which in turn MAY result in a better measurement result.

And Yes...I am aware of how the previous test was performed but no matter how you slice it DNLA Mode puts the whole conversion process load on the mRendu which goes against its intended purpose despite it having the ability to do it anyway.

As a side comment, I'm not married to this device in any way despite owning one myself. If it's proven to be crap then so be it. I can revert back to my previous small Linux box I've been using for the past 5 yrs with no issues and great results. My primary reasoning for the continued posts in this thread at this point are because I hope to see more complete testing performed on this device, in all modes and usage scenarios that matter, before I'm willing to box it up and sell it on Audiogon

 

[Tim Tom]

If it's proven to be crap then so be it. I hope to see more complete testing performed on this device, in all modes and usage scenarios that matter, before I'm willing to box it up and sell it on Audiogon

Have you actually listened to it in your system?

 

[NorthSky]

I searched and searched for this product's measurements and this is the only site here so far with the best collection of them.
Another great site to look for measurements: http://archimago.blogspot.ca/ ... but nothing on the Sonore MicroRendu.

• https://community.roonlabs.com/t/microrendu-measurements-thread/11761/120
• https://community.roonlabs.com/t/microrendu-measurements-thread/11761

 

[cjf]

Have you actually listened to it in your system?

Yes... I've been using mine for about a month now. In fact I'm listening to it now as I type this

 

[amirm]

My broken microRendu just got to them. Assuming I get a working one back I will test it in other modes.

 

[Tim Tom]

Yes... I've been using mine for about a month now. In fact I'm listening to it now as I type this

So a report on measurements is going to tell you whether you should like it or not?

 

[cjf]

So a report on measurements is going to tell you whether you should like it or not?

Yup, if the measurements show a bad result in the mode I'm using it in then I will indeed box it up and send it on its way quicker then shit thru a goose.

Life's too short to listen to compromised hi-fi

 

[NorthSky]

Just some to read: http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f...art-4-uploaded-and-complete-28982/#post555510

 

[Phelonious Ponk]

Just some to read: http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f...art-4-uploaded-and-complete-28982/#post555510

Patience runs thin. Did they ever get through the BS and actually present anything that disputes Amir's results?

Tim