Hifiman Sundara Review (headphone)

[johny_2000]

and the Monolith headphones How are they assembled?

I don't know. I have never owned Monolith headphones.

 

[radix]

Are there any reasons to buy Sundara now?
They've lowered the price over the years (2017-2024) and now cost $299 new / $199 refurb.
But from a technical driver configuration perspective, they seem outdated to me compared to more recent planar headphones.

Mine still sound as good as when they were not outdated. I also use EQ on them, which I think helps a fair bit.

You should really listen to them and the planar's you're interested in and see what you like. How headphones fit and feel is important too.

 

[johny_2000]

You should really listen to them and the planar's you're interested in and see what you like. How headphones fit and feel is important too.

Thank you! So far I've listened to the FiiO FT5 and Moondrop Para planar headphones, which seem to be later models than the Sundara.

The FiiO had a comfortable fit and a self-adjusting suspension headband. Compared to the Moondrop which had a terrible fit. Unfortunately, both had quality issues. That's why I returned them.

 

[radix]

Thank you! So far I've listened to the FiiO FT5 and Moondrop Para planar headphones, which seem to be later models than the Sundara.

The FiiO had a comfortable fit and a self-adjusting suspension headband. Compared to the Moondrop which had a terrible fit. Unfortunately, both had quality issues. That's why I returned them.

I have the sundara, the dca aeon 2 noire, DT 770 Pro (250R), and sony 1000xm5 (noise cancelling for travel). So, I have an open-back, closed-back, and noise cancelling. Plus the DT770 are some utility cans for use other places than my desktop.

I find the sundara very comfortable. They have super large circular ear pads and a pretty firm strap adjust with detents, so it stays in place. The dca noire is a tighter fit around the ear, so is a bit more placement sensitive, but it's closed so that likely helps keep the noise out better. The strap adjust on the noire is a bit loose when not under pressure being on the head, so I usually need to adjust it every time I put them on. The sony are very nice too for a noise cancelling. The DT 770 are pretty comfortable too, but not the same class as the others.

I use EQ on my RME ADI-2 Pro or in SoundSource for the sundara and aeon2 noire (I'd EQ the DT770 too if I used them there). Nothing major, but it is better sounding to me.

You can't EQ fit and comfort, so find a decent pair that fits well, then you can likely EQ them to taste, assuming they are reasonable close. At least that's my approach.

 

[johny_2000]

Today I got another planar headphones - DROP+DCA AEON OPEN X. The fit on the head is better than the Moondrop Para, but worse than the FiiO FT5, which had a self-adjusting headband and soft-fitting round velor ear pads. Out of the box they are too warm in the mid freqs and too weak in the sub-bass and high freqs. That is, a sort of “neutral” sound that is too boring for me. I started EQing them to my liking using RME or Equilizer APO+Peace. I added several AutoEQ compensations to the Harman 2018 curve and applied them, but it was still too veiled in the high freqs. I wonder if the default "white 1-notch" inserts are too dense and too damping? There are three different sets of inserts in the box that might be worth trying.

 

[pallas]

Bought the Sundara (2022) some time ago and I'm using it with a Qudelix 5K with PEQ (balanced Tripowin cable) in connection with USB Audio Player Pro on an Android phone.
Very happy with this set up, though I sometimes have the feeling it sounds a tiny, tiny bit "artificial".
I have tried many PEQ settings an found this one to be the most pleasing to my ears.

Preamp: -11.0 dB Filter
1: ON LSQ Fc 28 Hz Gain 6.00 dB Q 0.71 Filter
2: ON PK Fc 66 Hz Gain -0.80 dB Q 1.50 Filter
3: ON LSQ Fc 105 Hz Gain 5.50 dB Q 0.71 Filter
4: ON PK Fc 940 Hz Gain -1.0 dB Q 3.70 Filter
5: ON PK Fc 2250 Hz Gain 3.30 dB Q 1.40 Filter
6: ON PK Fc 6105 Hz Gain 2.2 dB Q 1.50 Filter
7: ON PK Fc 10000 Hz Gain -3.0 dB Q 4.00 Filter
8: ON HSQ Fc 10000 Hz Gain -1.0 dB Q 0.71

I will have now the opportunity to get a used RME ADI-2 DAC FS (AK4493) and was wondering how to convert the above 8-band setting to the 5-band PEQ of the RME ADI-2.

 

[staticV3]

Bought the Sundara (2022) some time ago and I'm using it with a Qudelix 5K with PEQ (balanced Tripowin cable) in connection with USB Audio Player Pro on an Android phone.
Very happy with this set up, though I sometimes have the feeling it sounds a tiny, tiny bit "artificial".
I have tried many PEQ settings an found this one to be the most pleasing to my ears.

Preamp: -11.0 dB Filter
1: ON LSQ Fc 28 Hz Gain 6.00 dB Q 0.71 Filter
2: ON PK Fc 66 Hz Gain -0.80 dB Q 1.50 Filter
3: ON LSQ Fc 105 Hz Gain 5.50 dB Q 0.71 Filter
4: ON PK Fc 940 Hz Gain -1.0 dB Q 3.70 Filter
5: ON PK Fc 2250 Hz Gain 3.30 dB Q 1.40 Filter
6: ON PK Fc 6105 Hz Gain 2.2 dB Q 1.50 Filter
7: ON PK Fc 10000 Hz Gain -3.0 dB Q 4.00 Filter
8: ON HSQ Fc 10000 Hz Gain -1.0 dB Q 0.71

That preset appears to peak at 0.5dB gain, which can cause digital clipping:


I'd advise to reduce the preamp to -11.6dB.

I will have now the opportunity to get a used RME ADI-2 DAC FS (AK4493) and was wondering how to convert the above 8-band setting to the 5-band PEQ of the RME ADI-2.

Somewhat tricky do so, since the RME has quite complicated PEQ constraints, which you can read on page 14+15 here: https://rme-audio.de/downloads/adi2remote_e.pdf

On that note, I'd advise you to update your ADI-2's firmware and use the Remote 2.0 Application to import your EQ presets. It's way more convenient than doing it with the knob.

Finally, here's the best RME conversion of your preset that I could work out:


Note that the first Parametric EQ band was changed to a Low Shelf type.

 

[pallas]

Thank you for the conversion of the EQ.

Somewhat tricky do so, since the RME has quite complicated PEQ constraints, which you can read on page 14+15 here: https://rme-audio.de/downloads/adi2remote_e.pdf

Tricky? Is it because the bands 2, 3 and 4 seem to be set to peak and only on band 1 and 5 there are selectable filter types?

 

[staticV3]

Tricky? Is it because the bands 2, 3 and 4 seem to be set to peak and only on band 1 and 5 there are selectable filter types?

Band 1&5 can be PK, HS, or LS
Band 2-4 can only be PK
Band 6 can only be HS
Band 7 can only be LS

Gain can be set between -12dB and +12dB, but only in 0.5dB steps

Frequency is 20-20k for Band 1-3, 200-20k for Band 4-5, 20-150 for Band 6, and 3k-10k for Band 7

Q can be 0.5-9.9 for Band 1-3, 0.5-5.0 for Band 4-5, and 0.5-1.5 for Band 6-7. And it can only be set in 0.1 steps.

All of this complicates the PEQ design, compared to more conventional PEQs where you can do whatever you want with each band.

 

[pallas]

All of this complicates the PEQ design, compared to more conventional PEQs where you can do whatever you want with each band.

Now I get it, I didn't read the manual carefully enough.
It is indeed a bit strange and complicated.
But there are not many other options for a DAC with PEQ beside the Qudelix 5K and the RME ADI-2...

I use EQ on my RME ADI-2 Pro or in SoundSource for the sundara and aeon2 noire (I'd EQ the DT770 too if I used them there). Nothing major, but it is better sounding to me.

Was wondering what settings you use for the Sundara... Would you mind sharing them?

 

[staticV3]

But there are not many other options for a DAC with PEQ beside the Qudelix 5K and the RME ADI-2...

There's a new kid on the block: Topping D50III

 

[pallas]

That's true about the Topping D50III.
I was a little vague. I meant a DAC, with PEQ and high end headphone amp all in one.