melloncolliecat
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- Jul 31, 2023
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This is the same profile FG 70 = Nude VDHFrom what I understand, they changed from VdH to FG at some point. Maybe all the specs just weren't updated.
Thanks! 14g effective mass, doesn't seem like a mismatch for the Ortofon..."DP-80 with FR-14 tonearm in a Resinamic plinth"
My AT33PTGii the CA -TRC-1007 test record gives som strange wiggles in the right channel that does not occur on other test records with this cartridge. Only this cart on this test record behaves like this, strange. This is why I have been reluctant to post it, but since you asked..Audio-Technica AT33PTG/II
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Notes
- These are from @mackat
- The second set was corrected to my CA TRS-1007
- Nude microlinear stylus with a boron cantilever
- This shows one of the general Audio-Technica house curves, roughly -0.5/+2.0
- Should sound fairly neutral as it is pretty much ±0.5 dB below 10kHz
- Excellent distortion results
- Azimuth needs further adjustment
- The headshell was not the best match for the tonearm
- This has been a popular cartridge amongst rippers (along with the AT-OC9ML/II)
- For very good reason I think
- My question is if it is worth the MC premium if you can load a comparable MM for similar results
- Comparison samples and stress tests would be helpful
- Does the boron cantilever afford noticeably better trackability than an aluminum one given same FR?
Check the German Lowbeats site for tests done on the 540 and internally identical (I believe) 740, the metal mounting bracket of the 740 making quite a difference, at least to them using a top model Rega tonearm (which doesn't add anything of its own here). They don't seem to do proper tests now, but here's the VM740 (you'll need to look up the page and read how tests were done)Audio-Technica VM540ML
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Notes
- New microlinear stylus with aluminum cantilever
- I got a crazy deal on this and I figured extra measurements could not hurt
- Distortion is as good as it gets
- DIN 45 543 shows around -34 dB crosstalk!
- This is my second favorite of the modern Audio-Technica house curves
- My preference is for the one that is approximately -0.5/+2.0 dB at a "standard load" of around 200pF
- That provides me room to adjust to taste by either loading at 100pF or 300pF
- But this works for me at 100pF or lower
- The question is if you gain anything with a more expensive option like the AT33PTG/II with a boron cantilever
- And also what you gain with this over the AT-V95ML
- And we can now more or less compare the three most popular microlinear options...
I'm as much concerned about the LF performance below 100Hz myself, but admit the tonearm mass, its mounting and general deck-feedback situation may modify any given results.Audio-Technica Microlinear Cartridge Comparison
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Note that the AT33PTG/II was measured with significant azimuth mis-adjustment and with a CBS STR-100 that was corrected for this and that the other two cartridges were measured on different turntables and with different loads so this is not an apples to apples to apples comparison. But they are also clearly all close enough for us to see the major differences, which are in frequency response extension. As the measurements have shown all 3 cartridges show excellent results when it comes to distortion and crosstalk. Theoretically, all three should maintain performance similarly as the microlinear styli move toward the inner groove of the record.
Here is a close-up showing extension more clearly.
View attachment 327822
Somethings I am thinking about:
- I think I can see a catch 22: given Audio-Technica's overall consistency with house curves they do not really take advantage of cantilever material with respect to FR possibility
- And given how FR tapers out as the cartridge moves along the record (amplitude drop) I am not saying that they don't have good reasons for their use of resonance as it might be a very sound engineering
- But is their current strategy to differentiate their product lines essentially to handicap them?
- I'm simplifying to be sure but it is productive to bracket by diamond shape (here microlinear)
- Distortion and crosstalk are in the same ballpark, and diamond shape performance should be too
- We have seen enough measurements to know that it actually takes effort to have a cartridge not extend to 20kHz
- This all seems so cynical to me
- Then again the medium's golden era ended 40 years ago and they are trying to make as much money as possible while they can
- This is why, despite the challenges of a diminishing number of quality goods, some of us still prefer buying older cartridges
- Remember that you can protect yourself by using test records and a good microscope
- But we also have a secret weapon: EQ
Audio-Technica Microlinear Cartridge Comparison
Click to increase size
View attachment 327821
Note that the AT33PTG/II was measured with significant azimuth mis-adjustment and with a CBS STR-100 that was corrected for this and that the other two cartridges were measured on different turntables and with different loads so this is not an apples to apples to apples comparison. But they are also clearly all close enough for us to see the major differences, which are in frequency response extension. As the measurements have shown all 3 cartridges show excellent results when it comes to distortion and crosstalk. Theoretically, all three should maintain performance similarly as the microlinear styli move toward the inner groove of the record.
Here is a close-up showing extension more clearly.
View attachment 327822
Somethings I am thinking about:
- I think I can see a catch 22: given Audio-Technica's overall consistency with house curves they do not really take advantage of cantilever material with respect to FR possibility
- And given how FR tapers out as the cartridge moves along the record (amplitude drop) I am not saying that they don't have good reasons for their use of resonance as it might be a very sound engineering
- But is their current strategy to differentiate their product lines essentially to handicap them?
- I'm simplifying to be sure but it is productive to bracket by diamond shape (here microlinear)
- Distortion and crosstalk are in the same ballpark, and diamond shape performance should be too
- We have seen enough measurements to know that it actually takes effort to have a cartridge not extend to 20kHz
- This all seems so cynical to me
- Then again the medium's golden era ended 40 years ago and they are trying to make as much money as possible while they can
- This is why, despite the challenges of a diminishing number of quality goods, some of us still prefer buying older cartridges
- Remember that you can protect yourself by using test records and a good microscope
- But we also have a secret weapon: EQ
maybe the thing in the end considered between 540 and 740... it is essentially the difference in weight for a little finer adaptation to the type of arm..Audio-Technica VM540ML
Click to increase size
View attachment 327808View attachment 327809
View attachment 327814View attachment 327815
View attachment 327816View attachment 327817
View attachment 327812View attachment 327810View attachment 327811
Notes
- New microlinear stylus with aluminum cantilever
- I got a crazy deal on this and I figured extra measurements could not hurt
- Distortion is as good as it gets
- DIN 45 543 shows around -34 dB crosstalk!
- This is my second favorite of the modern Audio-Technica house curves
- My preference is for the one that is approximately -0.5/+2.0 dB at a "standard load" of around 200pF
- That provides me room to adjust to taste by either loading at 100pF or 300pF
- But this works for me at 100pF or lower
- The question is if you gain anything with a more expensive option like the AT33PTG/II with a boron cantilever
- And also what you gain with this over the AT-V95ML
- And we can now more or less compare the three most popular microlinear options...
Check the German Lowbeats site for tests done on the 540 and internally identical (I believe) 740, the metal mounting bracket of the 740 making quite a difference, at least to them using a top model Rega tonearm (which doesn't add anything of its own here). They don't seem to do proper tests now, but here's the VM740 (you'll need to look up the page and read how tests were done)
View attachment 327825
Below is the 540 and I got the hint they used the same stylus in both bodies but could be mistaken here -
View attachment 327826
Knowing the general HF losses/compression in the vinyl medium as a rule, I think the 540 may be the 'better' of the two, but then, the general bright tones of the Basik Plus arm (not so different from the lower mass straight fixed head Sumiko sibling) for example and audio memories/impressions of the AT based Linn K9 used in it, I wonder if the slightly more 'old fashioned' VM740 tones might not be nicer subjectively.
P.S. Interesting that your plots look more like the VM740 that Lowbeats measured...
The CA TRS-1007 cannot handle crosstalk below -30kHz so it gets screwy. I get bad results when I try to adjust to it in similar situations. The left and right FR are overall very close to being parallel all the way through so I am confident it is close enough.Kind of uneven crosstalk on VM 540ML? Did you try to optimize it, but maybe the L/R frequency response suffered then?
Edit: I read the measurements backwards.Check the German Lowbeats site for tests done on the 540 and internally identical (I believe) 740, the metal mounting bracket of the 740 making quite a difference, at least to them using a top model Rega tonearm (which doesn't add anything of its own here). They don't seem to do proper tests now, but here's the VM740 (you'll need to look up the page and read how tests were done)
View attachment 327825
Below is the 540 and I got the hint they used the same stylus in both bodies but could be mistaken here -
View attachment 327826
Knowing the general HF losses/compression in the vinyl medium as a rule, I think the 540 may be the 'better' of the two, but then, the general bright tones of the Basik Plus arm (not so different from the lower mass straight fixed head Sumiko sibling) for example and audio memories/impressions of the AT based Linn K9 used in it, I wonder if the slightly more 'old fashioned' VM740 tones might not be nicer subjectively.
P.S. Interesting that your plots look more like the VM740 that Lowbeats measured...
I think we have seen that most cartridges perform similarly below 1kHz. You are right that the performance you are concerned about is more about cartridge/tonearm compatibility. See my 2 examples of the AT-V95ML to see performance differences on different mass tonearms.I'm as much concerned about the LF performance below 100Hz myself, but admit the tonearm mass, its mounting and general deck-feedback situation may modify any given results.
Knowing the general HF losses/compression in the vinyl medium as a rule, I think the 540 may be the 'better' of the two, but then, the general bright tones of the Basik Plus arm (not so different from the lower mass straight fixed head Sumiko sibling) for example and audio memories/impressions of the AT based Linn K9 used in it, I wonder if the slightly more 'old fashioned' VM740 tones might not be nicer subjectively.
I have been more and more curious about this. I am confident that CA TRS-1007 exhibits a sweep oscillator change at around 250Hz like the CBS STR-100 does at 5kHz. I *think* I see that it sometimes causes problems for my Denon DP-35F with some cartridges. (Or perhaps my damping is off.) I have another that I am restoring (motor related; seems to have a tonearm in excellent condition) and am looking to compare it to the one currently being used.Toneam and/or cartridge body resonances usually show up in the 100-500 Hz range. As seen on several fr response measurements.